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Anyone else think Steam Machines are going to be a massive flop?

Forums - Gaming Discussion - Anyone else think Steam Machines are going to be a massive flop?

Mummelmann said:

Steam Machines will have a hard time for sure, they're kind of an inbetween product that are neither here nor there, in my opinion and I haven't really seen much incentive for me to want one yet, and that is coming from possibly the biggest Valve fan in the Northern hemisphere.
My initial and main concern is the pricing though; they seem to place themselves above the One and PS4 in price on average, you get far more powerful hardware but that is certainly not a guarantee for sales (see original xbox for an example) and the somewhat wonky gamepad will likely turn a few people off, that also symbolizes the inbetween nature of the product for me; it ends up somewhere between traditional and touch and might very well miss both.

Gabe Newell and Valve; I love you and everything you do to bits and I consider this company to be the most positive influence on gaming in general in the past 20 years, along with the likes of CDProjekt, but I think you're making a big mistake with these machines, I simply cannot picture a sizeable market for them.


I almost feel like their goal isn't to sell a LOT of steam machines.

 

Just to sell enough to convince a number of people to make Linux games.

 

Why?  Windows 8 and it's apstore and a feeling MS might just try and shut down other shops



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sales2099 said:
Massive flop. Steam gamers are content with Steam on their PCs......why would they rebuy it?

Because Wireless or wired HDMIs don't exist :P



Squeezol's Fanclub Member? is that how it works?

Why can't I hold all these no gaemz?

Always looking to improve my awful drawings ;_; 

fatslob-:O said:
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:

Oh I know it won't succeed. But Steam Boxes are Steam's chance to break into the console industry, so when Consoles are eventually assimilated into PCs they will have a huge advantage, even against MS.

Problem is because the manufacturers are selling custom PC, a market that already exists, rather than steam consoles, its fails to reach both audiences. Not to mention those manufacturers couldn't sell the steam boxes at a loss because they aren't profitting from Steam's software sales.

Thus it has/had potential, but the execution is the major issue with it.

 

How is execution the issue when it was just a bad idea from the gecko ?

Even if steamOS had everything except for directx it would still fail miserably because it offers no differentiation between the PC and the console market. As blurred as the line is between console and PC they atleast have a factor that differentiates them such as easier accessiblity as well as having some high quality exclusive software. PC's have benefit of being able to do many things not related to gaming. Steam machine on the other hand will have almost nothing to differentiate it because Valve can't afford to support a huge platform as large as this. Valve has also failed to control the price that OEM's are charging which will mean that it will get a bad reputation as an overpriced console like the PS3 initially was. The controller is shit too as well.

Why didn't they realize all this ? 

The plan was bad all along and I just can't see it having any sort of potential.

The PS3 was not overpriced, in fact it was even the cheapest blu-ray player out there. Don't talk BS, tank you =)



Soleron said:

- From what I've seen elsewhere 15% scaling if you don't want ANY power or performance increase with that shrink. Also, it's compared to "a 20nm planar process" which doesn't actually exist. So the numbers are meaningless.

- Do NOT believe that timeline for Globalfoundries. Trust me, no production until 2016, definitely after TSMC.

@Bold Do you have a source for that ? It doesn't make any sense considering the fact that most of the gains come from using FinFet transistors and how would a different transistor technology be related to chip area scaling ? If that were the case it still wouldn't make any sense for globalfoundries to license samsung's 14nm technology. 

It's true that globalfoundries may have had alot of issues and delays in the past but at this point they've likely cancelled their 20nm process node and I don't think their customers would like to be held out for that long but to claim absolutely NO PRODUCTION of commercial 14nm wafers until 2016 sounds a bit overly critical. 

What amount of chip area scaling did Intel claim for their 14nm process ? The way I see it this isn't about minimum feature sizes anymore until extreme ultraviolet lithography comes into the picture as the semiconductor manufacturing industry has redefined it to about surpassing limits of last generation process technology. I remember them only claiming a chip area scaling of 35% better than TSMC's 20nm process node so in that sense Intel's 14nm process node also isn't a real 14nm node.

Intel's 14nm process node and Samsung's 14nm process node are closer than you think it is. 



These forums are always good for a laugh, so many insecure egos. No skin off my nose, I'm happy being one of the million Linux gamers currently on Steam.  Once Steam OS leaves alpha & becomes the target Linux OS for developers to aim for game development on Linux will become more straight forward since it will eliminate any distro fragmentation. As long as your distro has the same dependencies installed as Steam OS you're good to go, not to mention that graphics driver support has exploded in the last few months and Unreal Engine 4, & Cry Engine were just released for Linux in preparation for Steam OS which will make porting to Linux MUCH easier.  & just yesterday Codemasters pledged support.

 

Edit:  The purpose of the Steam Machines is to give a Linux compatable set of hardware that will work well with Steam OS for people who don't have the time/knowledge to build a fully Linux compatable machine themselves.  Valve doesn't care if you use their box, a third parties or build your own Steam Machine, or even if you use Ubuntu since all main Linux versions play Steam OS content & it's the content they want to sell.



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fatslob-:O said:
Soleron said:

...

@Bold Do you have a source for that ? It doesn't make any sense considering the fact that most of the gains come from using FinFet transistors and how would a different transistor technology be related to chip area scaling ? If that were the case it still wouldn't make any sense for globalfoundries to license samsung's 14nm technology. 

OK, I'm possibly wrong on the first part - it may be and not or. However, if you can tell me to which "industry planar 20nm process" the 15% figure refers to that'd be great. I think they're outright lying on that one.

It's true that globalfoundries may have had alot of issues and delays in the past but at this point they've likely cancelled their 20nm process node and I don't think their customers would like to be held out for that long but to claim absolutely NO PRODUCTION of commercial 14nm wafers until 2016 sounds a bit overly critical. 

Yeah it's just that I don't trust them to deliver when they failed to do so at 32, 28, 20 and their own 14. I agree, their customers will be very upset. But they need GF as a second source to Samsung. The rest of the industry only has a TSMC vs Samsung choice right now, because they have no access to Intel and wouldn't pick GF as a first source.

What amount of chip area scaling did Intel claim for their 14nm process ? The way I see it this isn't about minimum feature sizes anymore until extreme ultraviolet lithography comes into the picture as the semconductor manufacturing industry has redefined it to about surpassing limits of last generation process technology. I remember them only claiming a chip area scaling of 35% better than TSMC's 20nm process node so in that sense Intel's 14nm process node also isn't a real 14nm node.

This is the slide: http://www.extremetech.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/14nm-2.png

Intel is saying 22->14 scaling will be better than their own 32->22 scaling. That's the important takeaway.

TSMC has always been denser anyway, that's why "only" 35% vs TSMC. However, despite being less dense, Intel's always had a technologically better process than TSMC (superior frequency/power curve). It's a tradeoff for density vs power vs performance. TSMC can't run their chips at 3.6GHz like Intel, and if they did they'd be 200W monsters.

Intel's 14nm process node and Samsung's 14nm process node are closer than you think it is. 

I see Samsung 14nm as basically Intel 22nm.





sales2099 said:
Massive flop. Steam gamers are content with Steam on their PCs......why would they rebuy it?


well I am pretty sure the OS is free . No need to rebuy anything.



A Wii U, steam box combo could end up as cheaper option long term than a Wii U, gaming PC combo (Which is my alternate plan). I expect steam box prices to lower over time and the steam store has some very cheap games.

Due to the appeal of sleek and stylish laptops, I'm starting to move away from PC gaming. It's still to be seen how much is ported to linux, but it's is enough for me to hold off getting a ps4 and new gaming PC until I see where things are going.



I knew they would flop from the day they were announced.



They could be the future of consoles, or they could be a flop as you said. It's hard to say at this point because it's a very new idea.