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Forums - Politics Discussion - The Coming Obamacare Shock for 170 Million Americans

Mr Puggsly said:
the2real4mafol said:
Mr Puggsly said:


American Poverty = Living in better conditions than most of the world with an opportunity to get out of poverty

Tell that to the poor in places like Detroit, Chicago or LA or any big city. If you're born poor you are likely to stay poor unless very lucky.

Its not about luck, its about working hard and developing skills.

That's how you get out of poverty and get opportunities.

When there are more people looking for work than there are jobs, it is about luck. Full stop. In our environment of secular stagnation, the ones who get ahead are simply the ones lucky enough to not be squeezed out by the systemic contraction.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

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outlawauron said:
Game_God said:

So glad I live in Europe, here everyone is taken care of, for stiches I think that 10 bucks would be on the expensive side, 4 years ago I had knee surgery, I paid 80€ & most of that was the food! Same for education, 1 year in college is about 300/400€ depending on the cursus & the college. I really am not a fan of the American way: the land of oportunity as long as you are rich & healthy, the social ladder is missing a few steps over there...

It's taken care of because you're paying for it in another way.  >_>

Everyone pays their share in taxes, which is a much more equitable burden since a 1% can far more easily afford to lose a million dollars than a bottom 10% can afford to lose $50.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Mr Puggsly said:
the2real4mafol said:
Mr Puggsly said:


American Poverty = Living in better conditions than most of the world with an opportunity to get out of poverty

Tell that to the poor in places like Detroit, Chicago or LA or any big city. If you're born poor you are likely to stay poor unless very lucky.

Its not about luck, its about working hard and developing skills.

That's how you get out of poverty and get opportunities.

People who paid thousands of dollars to get into college can't get jobs. You expect a dude who has a high school degree working for 8$ to be able to get out of poverty while all the while praying he doesn't get into an accident because there's no nationalized health care and he has to pay it all out of his pocket.

Most developed European countries have much better social welfare than the United States. So no, I'd rather be poor in many other nations.



Figgycal said:
enditall727 said:

I have been living under a rock and haven't really cared to come out to take a peak at this.

@Spurge so basically.. what is this? Like what exactly are we supposed to do?

We are supposed to sign up for obama care for what? And how exactly do we do it?

.. And how is it going to affect our paychecks? Is it supposed to take like 10$ out of each paycheck or something?

 

Edit: i don't feel like looking it up on my own. 

Are you an adult?

Unfortunately, many adults are clueless (not to pass judgement as even the people who passed the ACA had no idea what was in that monterous bill) about the ACA and what it means for the future of the healthcare system and how it will affect their medical care going forward.

But that is exactly what the folks who drafted the law counted on. The low-information voters and people who pay very little attention to the big picture so to speak when it comes to what they feel is out of their control.



MARCUSDJACKSON said:
enditall727 said:
Figgycal said:
enditall727 said:

I have been living under a rock and haven't really cared to come out to take a peak at this.

@Spurge so basically.. what is this? Like what exactly are we supposed to do?

We are supposed to sign up for obama care for what? And how exactly do we do it?

.. And how is it going to affect our paychecks? Is it supposed to take like 10$ out of each paycheck or something?

 

Edit: i don't feel like looking it up on my own. 

Are you an adult?

I'm an infant

 

Lol

 

Yes i am and this is the part where you or somebody else says " how could you not know about this? You live in America and don't know about Obamacare?" Yada yada yada

 

I've been avoiding this Obamacare thing ever since the 1st time i attempted to look into it.

 

I know that the longer you wait, the more you will need to pay for healthcare each year or something like that. I just avoided it ever since then.

 

So just tell me how much obamacare asks you to pay each month

the penalty is $95. based on income. no penalty under the right inccome bracket.

Ok this is from when I did my taxes just a month ago or so.... The penalty for not having insurance this year, is $250, or 1% of your gross pay, whichever is higher.... Next year, the penalty goes up to around $1,000, the year after, around $2,300... That's as far as they go, for now... This is in California, don't know if it changes at all from state to state. Luckily, I have insurance through my work, for now. Someone asked how the gov is supposed to make money from this... If anyone remembers a politician bragging about how the gov would bring in over $30 billion dollars just from fines, that's how. Soon enough, insurance is going to be so fucking expensive, that even a $5,000 fine is going to look like a deal. Millions of people this year are clearly forgoing insurance and paying the small fine instead... Even if they only get the "low" fine of $250, if 10 million people decide that's the more affordable option, then this year alone, from a very conservative figure of ten million people, gives our lovely government a small sum of: $2,500,000,000.... Yes, only $2.5 billion. $2.5 billion collected from people who are not participating in, but essentially funding obamacare... It's a fucked up, giant money making sceam, made by a corrupt government, under the guise of "it's for the people".... And if any of you think I'm wrong..... Well, come back to this post in a year or two.... Or three.... But, it will ultimately be the downfall of this economy of ours... I'm sorry for the post on the back of your message... It's not directed at you, except for the part of how much the penalty is...



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SlayerRondo said:
As someone who does not believe in Obama-care for either economic or moral reasons I want as many people as possible to sign up for it so when the problems begin to mount up people will start to look at government as not a solver of problems but the largest cause of problems in modern society today. Slightly beating even the problems caused by religion.


I agree. Read my post above... I think you'll agree.



theprof00 said:
I dunno really much about this whole thing, but I feel like the free market will take care of this price increase.
If I were an insurer, I'd just keep the same rates and eat all the other insurer's dropouts.

I really don't understand why they are going up in premiums.


They're going up simply because you must buy. The insurance industry has suddenly been given a consumer base that has no choice. They know you, by law, must purchase their service, what in the world would make you think they'll suddenly give it away cheaper? With the huge deductibles, they will have a bunch of insured customers, who can't afford to use it....



theprof00 said:
I dunno really much about this whole thing, but I feel like the free market will take care of this price increase.
If I were an insurer, I'd just keep the same rates and eat all the other insurer's dropouts.

I really don't understand why they are going up in premiums.


Because the coverage they are required to provide has gotten more comprehensiv and so the pricing teirs have disappeared and they now have to provide coverage to ANYONE including those who have never paid a health care premium in their lives until the day they finally get sick then they decide to get health insurance. Not to mention, and I have seen this in my practice (I'm a Registered Nurse), people are already treating the system as an endless resource. And because customer satisfaction is becoming more and more tied to reimbursement Doctors and mid-level providers especially (Physician Assistants and Nurse Practitioners) are obliging them out of fear of not getting paid.

While that last part sounds good to the uninitiated, think about the patient, and we see them all the time, who gets the flu or some other viral infection and demands we give them antibiotics. We will usually tell them no and try to educate them on why we don't give antibiotics for viral infections (antibiotics work for bacterial infections) they sometimes get upset to the point where they complain or even try to sue etc.

Couple all that with what is now an even less competetive market than it was befoe and you get major price increases.

It was all built into and designed to do specifically this. It is the attempt to kill off private insurance to bring about single payer top down government run health care.



the2real4mafol said:
Mr Puggsly said:
the2real4mafol said:
Should of just funded the healthcare with taxes like the UK. You lot are only paying for a bloated army right now, a couple wars and some fascist mass spying organisations. Good priority of American government with so many in poverty!


American Poverty = Living in better conditions than most of the world with an opportunity to get out of poverty

Tell that to the poor in places like Detroit, Chicago or LA or any big city. If you're born poor you are likely to stay poor unless very lucky. Being poor is a bit of a disadvantage to doing well in the current system. And if American federal government ensured just two things, they would make things alot better for people. $15 minimum wage and a tax funded health service. Hell the money saved from eliminating the free market from core parts of healthcare would save alot of money for all.

Why else does the US spend 17% of GDP on health while European countries with a NHS style system or a mixed public/ private healthcare system spend around 8 to 10% of GDP. It certaintly adds up and its nice to known I can get treatment if I needed it without worrying about the cost.  


I find it funny when people think raising the minimum wage is the answer... What do you think happens when minimum wage goes up? The price of everything goes up too... So they'll make a little more, and spend a little more, but wind up in the same place: broke. I have a friend who manages a local Walgreens store... As soon as it was known that minimum wage was going up, prices went up on many products... One week later, he showed me a list of items, hundreds of them, that were already raised, or will soon be going up... Just by the news of minimum wage going up.... Getting a better job, not raising minimum wage, is the answer to making more money....



the2real4mafol said:
Should of just funded the healthcare with taxes like the UK. You lot are only paying for a bloated army right now, a couple wars and some fascist mass spying organisations. Good priority of American government with so many in poverty!


Woah woah woah! We American's will spend as much money as possible on blowing stuff up, but never ask us to spend money on health or education!



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