Forums - Politics Discussion - The Coming Obamacare Shock for 170 Million Americans

theprof00 said:
I dunno really much about this whole thing, but I feel like the free market will take care of this price increase.
If I were an insurer, I'd just keep the same rates and eat all the other insurer's dropouts.

I really don't understand why they are going up in premiums.

Because the number of things the insurance companies are required to provide coverage for has increased taking away the choice for policy holders.

I don't support people being required to pay for any type of coverage but some of the things they are required to cover are completely absurd.



This is the Game of Thrones

Where you either win

or you DIE

Around the Network
Mr Puggsly said:
the2real4mafol said:
Should of just funded the healthcare with taxes like the UK. You lot are only paying for a bloated army right now, a couple wars and some fascist mass spying organisations. Good priority of American government with so many in poverty!


American Poverty = Living in better conditions than most of the world with an opportunity to get out of poverty

Tell that to the poor in places like Detroit, Chicago or LA or any big city. If you're born poor you are likely to stay poor unless very lucky. Being poor is a bit of a disadvantage to doing well in the current system. And if American federal government ensured just two things, they would make things alot better for people. $15 minimum wage and a tax funded health service. Hell the money saved from eliminating the free market from core parts of healthcare would save alot of money for all.

Why else does the US spend 17% of GDP on health while European countries with a NHS style system or a mixed public/ private healthcare system spend around 8 to 10% of GDP. It certaintly adds up and its nice to known I can get treatment if I needed it without worrying about the cost.  



Switch and PS4

'When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called the people's stick'- Mikhail Bakunin

Prediction: Switch will sell better than Wii U Lifetime Sales by Jan 1st 2018

In Spain, my country, we fight against government because they want to privatize health insurance. Here is public and free, funded by taxes, and we are proud of it. I don't understand why people in the US don't want health coverage for all. Money? I think this is very selfish. There is a lot of people who needs it. I don't care democrats or republicans. I vote in Spain and these parties don't exist. But help others is a good action in all cultures in the world. It's universal. Don't let the media manipulate you. I don't like Obama, but I think this project is good for millions of Americans. Millions.

PenguinZ said:

ACA is a disaster.

For starters, my family and I pay more for insurance for noticeably less coverage. My dad can't even get the medicine he needs... insurance won't cover. In addition I got my hours limited at work, because the company doesn't want to cover benefits... I used to get at least 30 hours a week on most weeks and 40+ during the summer season and winter holidays... Now I average 21 hours a week and can't work any more than 28... I lost a huge chunk of income.

Thanks Obama, Congress, and Senate for screwing up.

If you are working for a company that is screwed up enough to cut your hours to avoid paying you benefits, its time to find a better company. I am in California, a state natoriously high priced for pretty much everything. When I went online and looked, for a family of five...mine, I would pay under $200/month for very good insurance with pretty low premiums. Much cheaper than some Cobra plan. Stated that opted out are going to feel the pinch a lot more than the ones who signed on. Expect premiums is those states to sky rocket due to a lack of federal funding. I think people need to quick bitching about something they havent had any experience with yet, quit listening to idiotic politicians and let everything just play out. We are becoming a country of indisusion and infighting to the point of becoming stale.



the2real4mafol said:
Mr Puggsly said:


American Poverty = Living in better conditions than most of the world with an opportunity to get out of poverty

Tell that to the poor in places like Detroit, Chicago or LA or any big city. If you're born poor you are likely to stay poor unless very lucky.

Its not about luck, its about working hard and developing skills.

That's how you get out of poverty and get opportunities.



Recently Completed: Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Saints Row: Gat Out of Hell for 360 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Destiny: Rise of Iron for X1 (3/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Destiny: Taken King for X1 (3/5) - Street Fighter V (General Story) for PS4 (3/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

the2real4mafol said:
Mr Puggsly said:
the2real4mafol said:
Should of just funded the healthcare with taxes like the UK. You lot are only paying for a bloated army right now, a couple wars and some fascist mass spying organisations. Good priority of American government with so many in poverty!


American Poverty = Living in better conditions than most of the world with an opportunity to get out of poverty

Tell that to the poor in places like Detroit, Chicago or LA or any big city. If you're born poor you are likely to stay poor unless very lucky. Being poor is a bit of a disadvantage to doing well in the current system. And if American federal government ensured just two things, they would make things alot better for people. $15 minimum wage and a tax funded health service. Hell the money saved from eliminating the free market from core parts of healthcare would save alot of money for all.

Why else does the US spend 17% of GDP on health while European countries with a NHS style system or a mixed public/ private healthcare system spend around 8 to 10% of GDP. It certaintly adds up and its nice to known I can get treatment if I needed it without worrying about the cost.  

Being born poor in the current system is a disadvantage in any part of the country and sadly people look to government for a solution to these problems. Government restrictions on labor in the forms of licenses, minimum wage and other regulatory burdens make it near impossible for those without wealthy parents and government priveleges to work their way up.



This is the Game of Thrones

Where you either win

or you DIE

SlayerRondo said:
theprof00 said:
I dunno really much about this whole thing, but I feel like the free market will take care of this price increase.
If I were an insurer, I'd just keep the same rates and eat all the other insurer's dropouts.

I really don't understand why they are going up in premiums.

Because the number of things the insurance companies are required to provide coverage for has increased taking away the choice for policy holders.

I don't support people being required to pay for any type of coverage but some of the things they are required to cover are completely absurd.

while aca does it all for cheaper?
To me this looks just like all the insurance companies are making a cash grab.

Bet we'll see record profits this year.



theprof00 said:
I dunno really much about this whole thing, but I feel like the free market will take care of this price increase.
If I were an insurer, I'd just keep the same rates and eat all the other insurer's dropouts.

I really don't understand why they are going up in premiums.

There are two major reasons.

 

1) For one, for insurance to work, it has to cost more then treatment will.  Since this law now makes it so that sick people can sign up whenever they want for healthcare.   It has to go up quite a bit.

Since someone who is middle class or just above medicaid can more or less just pay the fine, and jump on healthcare whenever they need.

Considering that health insurers never made much of a profit to begin with, this is a huge jump.

Which is basically what rich people did anyway.   

 

2) The ACA is subsidizing the middle and upper class so you don't have to pay more then a percentage of what you make in income for brozne and silver plans.

Meaning it's impossible to undercut in these plans because the government is going to pay for everything over anyway.

 

Meaning healthcare companies will max out these premiums within reason.



theprof00 said:
SlayerRondo said:
theprof00 said:
I dunno really much about this whole thing, but I feel like the free market will take care of this price increase.
If I were an insurer, I'd just keep the same rates and eat all the other insurer's dropouts.

I really don't understand why they are going up in premiums.

Because the number of things the insurance companies are required to provide coverage for has increased taking away the choice for policy holders.

I don't support people being required to pay for any type of coverage but some of the things they are required to cover are completely absurd.

while aca does it all for cheaper?
To me this looks just like all the insurance companies are making a cash grab.

Bet we'll see record profits this year.


Actually, it's been my expericne that the ACA plans are far more expensive then non exchange plans due to the subsidies offered for ACA plans.


Which is bad news because a lot of people are ONLY using the ACA website as a source for healthcare information, because they thought it was supposed to be a comprhensive exchange that everything was on.

One of the big defense manuevers of the ACA was to scour basically every single insurer with someone who complained in a news story, to find them a cheaper rate.  (Even then, they weren't that cheap in a lot of cases.)

Something most people don't really have the time for.



Around the Network
the2real4mafol said:
Mr Puggsly said:
the2real4mafol said:

 

Tell that to the poor in places like Detroit, Chicago or LA or any big city. If you're born poor you are likely to stay poor unless very lucky. Being poor is a bit of a disadvantage to doing well in the current system. And if American federal government ensured just two things, they would make things alot better for people. $15 minimum wage and a tax funded health service. Hell the money saved from eliminating the free market from core parts of healthcare would save alot of money for all.

 


To me likely means 50%+. 

 

This seems.... pretty decent to me quite honestly.

 

Now lets compare this to the UK... since it's where your from and has the things you find.

I can't find an exact equal comparison, but I can find two that are similar covering both ends... and they're on one chart.

 

http://www.leftfootforward.org/2011/03/social-mobility-income-inequality-resolution-foundation-report/

In both the 90's and 2000's, the UK had MORE poor people stuck in the lowest quintile then the United States, in the decade between 96 and 2005.  

Despite the UK's public healthcare and higher minium wage.  Considering that both ends find the same problem it's highly unlikely that 96-2005 Britian would do any better in a comparison then 1990-1999 and 2000-2009

 

and that's not even counting the fact that just... way more rich people choose to live in the United States then other countries, which will stretch out the quintile curve compaired to if you used something better then relative mobility.