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Forums - Politics Discussion - What does Putin want with Ukraine

 

What is his end state

Annex Ukraine As a whole 337 40.60%
 
Annex Crimea 286 34.46%
 
Defend Russian People Fro... 184 22.17%
 
Total:807
ArnoldRimmer said:

The situation is really becoming more and more disturbing...

When armed right sector ultra-nationalists surrounded and destroyed a tent-camp of pro-russian activists, the activsts fled to the nearby trade unions house. The trade unions house was then set ablaze by pro-kiew terrorists throwing molotov cocktails,  tear gas, stun grenades etc. inside the building.

In their desparation, some activists jumped out of the windows, several floors down - some survived, lying on the floor badly injured, only to instantly get attacked with bats and chains by an angry right sector mob.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BmpXpVfIUAAC6jh.jpg

Most others weren't so lucky - dozens died a horrible death in the flames, leaving only burned corpses behind (NSFW!):

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=237320516464430&set=a.113043968892086.1073741828.100005594497122&type=1

Hundreds of policemen were standing around, doing absolutely nothing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1OqU3abolg

The day I watched it live I had a feeling that this looks familiar (the very same day shots have been fired in Slavyansk, doubt this is a coincidence). At the time there was a dead body in the pro-Maidan crowd already (with a gun shot in the back, which is starnge) and few people injured, eventually crowd started to throw rocks and Molotov cocktails -- I didn't see at whom, but assumed those were pro-Russian protestors -- on the next day I've learned all the details.

It sort of a confirmation bias, I must admit, but that's because scenario is so familiar to me -- who are these people with red armbands -- I noticed them too, as they were easily the most aggressive part of the crowd, but didn't pay much attention to them.

Now I have a feeling that was not only a provocation with tragic consequences, but a provocation that involved certain police officers. The biggest part of the pro-Maidan crowd just have been used as useful idiots. Football fans were the majority of that crowd, they are stupid and controllable, a perfect fit for a scapegoat. It is sooo Maidan- and SBU-style.



Around the Network

Rumors spread that acutal number of victims in Odessa is over 100, significant part of the bodies have gun shot wounds, certain identified victims do not have anything in common with Antimaidan movement in Odessa and apparently were just accidental witnesses.

Time will tell how much true this is.



http://www.bild.de/politik/ausland/nachrichtendienste-usa/dutzende-agenten-von-cia-und-fbi-beraten-kiew-35807724.bild.html
For german speaking forummates. Something about involvment of CIA and FBI to Ukraine affairs, who can briefly tell me in English what this article is about?



Link with photos, videos and translations of the Odessa tragedy.
http://ersieesist.livejournal.com/813.html?nojs=1





Around the Network

http://mid.ru/bdomp/ns-dgpch.nsf/03c344d01162d351442579510044415b/38fa8597760acc2144257ccf002beeb8/$FILE/White_book.pdf



Nintendo 2018

English is not my native language.
mind said:
http://mid.ru/bdomp/ns-dgpch.nsf/03c344d01162d351442579510044415b/38fa8597760acc2144257ccf002beeb8/$FILE/White_book.pdf

They better release an all-around journalistic investigation of Odessa massacre, since there's little hope for actual investigation. Preferably in English, because as of now the MSM stance on this  more or less -- there was some fire in the Trade House Building and 40+ smth people have died, no big deal -- little to no attention paid to people jumping out of windows to their doom and slaughtered by the mob, and more importantly not a single word about provocateurs with red armbands and victims with gun wounds inside the building, which, my impression of it, have been shot and then burned, but not by a mob. The mob is just a scapegoat even though they deserve all the punishement, and by punishement I mean vigilante incidents, since authorites are doing nothing.



ArnoldRimmer said:

The situation is really becoming more and more disturbing...

When armed right sector ultra-nationalists surrounded and destroyed a tent-camp of pro-russian activists, the activsts fled to the nearby trade unions house. The trade unions house was then set ablaze by pro-kiew terrorists throwing molotov cocktails,  tear gas, stun grenades etc. inside the building.

In their desparation, some activists jumped out of the windows, several floors down - some survived, lying on the floor badly injured, only to instantly get attacked with bats and chains by an angry right sector mob.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BmpXpVfIUAAC6jh.jpg

Most others weren't so lucky - dozens died a horrible death in the flames, leaving only burned corpses behind (NSFW!):

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=237320516464430&set=a.113043968892086.1073741828.100005594497122&type=1

Hundreds of policemen were standing around, doing absolutely nothing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1OqU3abolg


Sort of misses the whole first part of the event....

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-27275383

 



Kasz216 said:

Sort of misses the whole first part of the event....

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-27275383

Why waste time reading through BBC when I just give a link to a report from the witness that discusses people with red armbands in detail? They have nothing to do with the people who gathered on Kulikovo Pole, who for the most part fell victim of fire in Trade Union House.



Mapping 360 Years Of A Divided Ukraine

I have a feeling that Tyler of ZH sometimes gathers his info from the Russian part of the Internet, as this pic is long-running meme that has been often used to troll "svidomiy" (politically or national conscious people in Ukraine) of various kinds :D

 

"These changes in the territories clearly indicate that ethnically Russian population is not a phenomena of colonisation post 1922 famine, but an outcome of centuries old movements of people with changes and reshaping of national, political, economic and cultural boundaries."

Strictly speaking even the territory mentioned as "Ukrainian territory in 1654" never was referred as "Ukraine". 1654 is the year of Treaty of Pereyaslav, when Zaporozhian Cossaks led by Bogdan Khmelnytsky have accepted the rule of Russian Tsar over them. Ukraine made its way to reality and political map 250 plus smth years later.