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Locked: George Takei’s Ripping Letter to AZ about ‘Turn Away the Gay’ Bill

Forums - Politics Discussion - George Takei’s Ripping Letter to AZ about ‘Turn Away the Gay’ Bill

ninetailschris said:

Note didn't read who you were responding to but will take what you said as face value.

... // ...

 arents shouldn't teach there children to be atheist because I personally feel it's dangarous? I would be called a bigot.

Third of all you give no reason why your own standards are better than Christianity. You just assert that it's worst. Tell me why on atheism morality isn't just something that is completely subjective. If it is subjective than why are you upset since everything relative. It's real easy to give critism towards Christianity standards when you have none.

 

English isn't this person first language so take their message with a certain amount of leniency. For example, learning in the first sentence really should be 'follow. We shouldn't force a child to follow a religion but we should teach them about all faiths so they can understand and respect them better. And 'tolerate' in the final sentence would work better if it was 'accept'.

Not trying tp put words in his mouth but his point was that even though he is athiest and his girlfriend religious, they are respectful towards people and this is the most important thing.



Hmm, pie.

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naruball said:
Justagamer said:
Pardon my ignorance, but, what is lgbt? I only have one thing I want to say, I don't beleive a law can exist like this in this day and age, love who you want, it has never bothered me. I have a gay cousin, never bothered me. If there is one thing that had bothered me is this: gay parades.... Seriously, they don't need to go and have a parade to proclaim their sexuality! Straight people don't have straight parades. Just my 2 cents... Maybe it's worth only 1 cent, but, it is what it is.... Not trying to be offensive, that's just how I feal about that one thing in particular.....


I'm a gay man and I don't like most gay parades. I find the people there too vulgar from the pictures I've seen (both from the media and from gay friends from fb). I went once to a parade and didn't like the people there either. Too much nudity and over the top acts. 

The idea of a parade though is not bad. The parade is supposed to raise awareness. It's supposed to encourage people, primarily young kids/teenagers to be ok with who they are. There's still oppression of gays especially at school, while no one gets beaten up for saying they're straight. A straight parade would make no sense, since they have no rights to fight for. They don't experience violence or discrimination for being straight (maybe for being fat, nerdy, not clever etc, but not straight). They're not supposed to go and proclaim their sexuality, but to show to the world that they don't think that they have anything to be ashamed of. Needless to say, you're not offensive at all. I get why people don't like or understand them. 


Thank you for understanding where I'm coming from. I didn't clarify what I meant about what I dislike about the parades, but you did that for me quite well! I failed to mention that the reason I dislike them is for the same reasons you said, over the top, overly sexual behavior(making out everywhere, and more), not that kissing is bad, just as with any couple, gay or straight, it's about right time right place. My example of a straight parade was just to exemplify what I meant: it wouldn't be acceptable to me if the were just being naked, and sucking face up and down, just to demonstrate their.... Straightness?... People are different the world over, and like and love what and who they want. People need to let everyone be free and feel free to do what they want. And again, thank you for understanding!



Marks said:
Somebody call the WHAAAAAAAAAMBULANCE......oh no imagine that, a state is RESTORING THE FREEDOM to businesses to serve who they want.

Okay I haven't read the bill, so I can only go by what was said in this article. But if all this bill does is allow business owners to discriminate AS THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO...then I have no problem with it.

Okay so say you're a gay guy visiting Arizona. You try to stop in at Restaurant A for a nice dinner but they refuse you service...then tell them to go fuck themselves, and go across the street to Restaurant B, or down the road to Restaurant C....whichever one will serve gays, and give that non-homophobic restaurant owner your money instead!!!

Look, I don't support discrimination or hate. But what I do support is RIGHTS and FREEDOMS of business owners. If they want to be a douchebag and refuse service based on personal hate then so be it....and watch as your business gets negative press, loses reputation, loses customers, and hopefully go out of business. This new bill is actually a good thing for gays, it'll help put homophobic businesses out of practice.

While i do agree with you, it is a slippery slope.  I mean right now we allow business to deny service to people for not wearing shirts, not wearing a tie, waring a baseball cap backwards, ect.  Bascially for not fitting their dress code.

But if we start getting into denying people for religious beliefs, or sexual orientation, how long until we are back onto having white only water fountains, ect.

If this law does get passed I hope for one that the business that refuse gays go out of business. i  hope that the capitlistic envirionment makes this law pointless.  The consumers cast their own vote by not eating or going to establishments that refuse gay entry.  

I'm all for giving business' rights, but I hope that us consumers are smart enough to vote our wallets away from stupid laws.  

Heck let this law pass, then let every business who is stupid enough to deny gays loose a shit ton of money and go out of business.  That would almost be the best.  The law may acutally benefit mankind by putting those idiots out of business and take away thier money.



Justagamer said:


Just wanted to say this to you. You are way off man! Your English is quite excellent, and should never refrain from posting because of errors! There are people whose use of English are far worse than yours, and it's their first language! 


Thanks but, i usually have to do many thinking, rewrite + edit and some time google translate, because i don't learned the word while playing english game with a dictionnary ^^ so more easy to just read, and if i see a point to talk i try ^^

Anyway i wish, everyone would just be happy with their live and not take care about other as much as now.



irstupid said:
Marks said:
Somebody call the WHAAAAAAAAAMBULANCE......oh no imagine that, a state is RESTORING THE FREEDOM to businesses to serve who they want.

Okay I haven't read the bill, so I can only go by what was said in this article. But if all this bill does is allow business owners to discriminate AS THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO...then I have no problem with it.

Okay so say you're a gay guy visiting Arizona. You try to stop in at Restaurant A for a nice dinner but they refuse you service...then tell them to go fuck themselves, and go across the street to Restaurant B, or down the road to Restaurant C....whichever one will serve gays, and give that non-homophobic restaurant owner your money instead!!!

Look, I don't support discrimination or hate. But what I do support is RIGHTS and FREEDOMS of business owners. If they want to be a douchebag and refuse service based on personal hate then so be it....and watch as your business gets negative press, loses reputation, loses customers, and hopefully go out of business. This new bill is actually a good thing for gays, it'll help put homophobic businesses out of practice.

While i do agree with you, it is a slippery slope.  I mean right now we allow business to deny service to people for not wearing shirts, not wearing a tie, waring a baseball cap backwards, ect.  Bascially for not fitting their dress code.

But if we start getting into denying people for religious beliefs, or sexual orientation, how long until we are back onto having white only water fountains, ect.

If this law does get passed I hope for one that the business that refuse gays go out of business. i  hope that the capitlistic envirionment makes this law pointless.  The consumers cast their own vote by not eating or going to establishments that refuse gay entry.  

I'm all for giving business' rights, but I hope that us consumers are smart enough to vote our wallets away from stupid laws.  

Heck let this law pass, then let every business who is stupid enough to deny gays loose a shit ton of money and go out of business.  That would almost be the best.  The law may acutally benefit mankind by putting those idiots out of business and take away thier money.


I certainly agree, it is a slippery slope. Right now it's homosexuals, tomorrow it's hispanics, blacks, etc. Hell there could even be a law where all discrimination is allowed and Black business owners can refuse whites if they want. 

But I'm glad you saw the point I was making, and didn't just call me a homophobe for saying I support this law (in a sense). I hope the true nature of capitalism, and the desire to make money (by having a full hotel, restaurant, etc.) is more important than one's irrational hate of gays. 

I bolded your paragraph that I really agree with! Not only will the businesses that utilize this law lose gay customers...but they will lose straight customers who boycott it. 



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TruckOSaurus said:
My respect for Apple just went up a whole lot: http://business.time.com/2014/02/25/how-apple-went-to-war-over-arizona-anti-gay-bill/

It's really nice to see them take a stand against this state-sanctioned discrimination law.


So basically what this tells us is....

 

Tim cook is a much nicer guy then Steve Jobs, who only wanted to take up for peoples rights when it wouldn't cost him any money.



Kasz216 said:
curl-6 said:
Justagamer said:
Pardon my ignorance, but, what is lgbt? I only have one thing I want to say, I don't beleive a law can exist like this in this day and age, love who you want, it has never bothered me. I have a gay cousin, never bothered me. If there is one thing that had bothered me is this: gay parades.... Seriously, they don't need to go and have a parade to proclaim their sexuality! Straight people don't have straight parades. Just my 2 cents... Maybe it's worth only 1 cent, but, it is what it is.... Not trying to be offensive, that's just how I feal about that one thing in particular.....

LGBT = Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transexual

Well, the prefrered term is just trangender or just trans lately.

As trans status doesn't really correlate with sexual preference.

A Trans man may be attracted to men, may be attracted to women.

Additionally the term reinforces gender with biological gender, which are two different things.

 

So Iot of trans people get offended by everything.

I don't really want to be too insensitive here, but isn't that really the MO? 



Kane1389 said:

This is nothing like segregation or jim crow, where institutions and people were forced by the goverment to discriminate against people. This law simply gives buisness owners  the freedome to deny service to someone they dont want have any buisness with. 

And you can fight ''bigotry and discrimination'' on an a federal level, but not on a private level. People should be allowed to have whatever beliefs they want, regardless of how you precieve them

Really? Nothing like segregation? If you're God fearing Christian it's against your religious belief to serve single mothers, divorced people, atheists, agnostics, muslims, jews, pagans, mormons... not just LGBT people. And do you really think that a business owner can afford to express his religious belief and deny sevices to all people against whom Bible has something to say. Of course not. They'll only hate on gays, because it's the most convenient. Like always good Christian hypocrisy.

People are allowed to believe in whatever nonsense they want to believe. That's their PRIVATE right, and that right should stay there and be PRIVATE. Your freedom, doesn't give you right to reduce my FREEDOM. That's the fundamental difference that bigots like yourself don't understand. 



Tom3k said:

Really? Nothing like segregation? If you're God fearing Christian it's against your religious belief to serve single mothers, divorced people, atheists, agnostics, muslims, jews, pagans, mormons... not just LGBT people. And do you really think that a business owner can afford to express his religious belief and deny sevices to all people against whom Bible has something to say. Of course not. They'll only hate on gays, because it's the most convenient. Like always good Christian hypocrisy.

People are allowed to believe in whatever nonsense they want to believe. That's their PRIVATE right, and that right should stay there and be PRIVATE. Your freedom, doesn't give you right to reduce my FREEDOM. That's the fundamental difference that bigots like yourself don't understand.

It's not a big secret that large groups of Christians really like to cherry-pick their stuff when it comes to the Bible huh. Whatever happened to "love thy neighbour" or even "hate the sin, not the sinner". Maybe it's for the better or stoning and the like would be commonplace.

Regarding the gay-parades mentioned before: it's just one day in a year. There are also things like the Mardi Gras and Carnival, let people have their fun those couple of days. I simply do not attend... (Well I did once and it was nice but it's not for me)



Kane1389 said:
curl-6 said:

You just confirmed what I said. You would be okay with businesses being able to turn away blacks for being black.

You really are amazing. I simply adore how you single out blacks to make me appear racist and a bad person.

No, but seriously, can your strawman sink any lower?

realize from your other comments you have a very limited understand of the United State, it's values, foundation and history.  It’s a direct reference that most would understand from an awful time when people tried legally separate people based on perceived skin color and race.  Most all accept that this was wrong (except for the bigots.)

The point is institutionalized discrimination is wrong.  If you don’t understand that then, I guess you will have to wait till it hits you, your family, or someone you care/know about to understand.

We should not go back to these times.



 

Really not sure I see any point of Consol over PC's since Kinect, Wii and other alternative ways to play have been abandoned. 

Top 50 'most fun' game list coming soon!

 

Tell me a funny joke!