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Forums - General Discussion - So George Zimmerman shot a boy who's not old enough to drink, 2 times in the back, and 1 to 6 times in the balls (like Robocop) in self defense?

Mr Puggsly on 03 February 2014
hollabackenny said:

What are these people supposed to prove? All I'm getting is what a bunch of people who weren't there thought would happen under different circumstances. 

Celebrity Opinions > Facts



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hollabackenny on 03 February 2014
Mr Puggsly said:
hollabackenny said:

What are these people supposed to prove? All I'm getting is what a bunch of people who weren't there thought would happen under different circumstances. 

Celebrity Opinions > Facts


Unfortunately people believe every thing  they watch on youtube.



superchunk on 03 February 2014
Kaizar said:
superchunk said:
1) where the hell did you get your facts on the case?
2) Trayvon was physically and adult... so tired of the little boy description.
3) Trayvon wasn't a great person either.

While zimmerman should have listed to the damn police and stayed away... I'm positive the incident escalated due to two stupid men acting like foolish assholes. Unfortunately for one, he died.

It sounds like Trayvon was follow by only one pair of head lights beaming him around throught the middle of the night, so he decided to walk a different direction away from home, because who's not gonna notice the only beam lights following them all night.

It also sounds like if Trayvon was a young blonde white woman being stalk by a overwieght middle age man in the middle of the night and was suddenly having the creepy middle-age stranger trap her shoulder, then she would have taken one of the only 2 options. Which is either run or fight, and the younger generation is much more wiser, and knows that everyone is a punk bitch, so obviously would choose to fight the creepy middle-age stranger who would have just shot her dead, and be found innocent in the case, like what happened in real life.....just replace the young blonde white female with a young black male.

This is nothing more then 2nd class treatment because the murdered adult wasn't a blonde white female.

Its obvious Zimmerman wouldn't have followed someone who didn't look like a potential thug/theif. Any random woman, he likely wouldn't have followed much at all. But you can't change the facts to an unending set of "what ifs". That's just ignorant.

Fact is you had an ignorant man with a false sense of power witnessed a hooded thug looking-man walking through his neighborhood at night. A place that had seen numerous robberies recently. The ignorant man decided to ignore repeated requests by operators to not interfere and wait for police. The ignorant man then proceeded to confront the person he believed was likely up to no good. The man-looking-thug-dressing 17yr old ignorantly decided to be aggressive back and a fight ensued. If you've seen the pictures of Zimmerman, you know he was getting beat in that fight and very likely and ignorantly both parties saw the gun and likely went for it. Zimmerman happened to get it first. 

Its not a race issue. Making it one is what is ignorant.

Its an issue of stupidity at the highest levels. Its an issue of people not acting like people and instead acting out of fear/anger/rage. Its an issue of men not knowing how to act towards other men without trying to be tough.

Its horrible Trayvon had to die, but the jury made the right decision given the evidence.

There are real race issues in this country. This wasn't one of them.



nitekrawler1285 on 03 February 2014
Mr Puggsly said:
Kaizar said:
Mr Puggsly said:
For the record, Trayvon was practically an adult and just shy of 6 feet tall.

He was not a boy.


What if the seventeen year old black male was a blonde white female who was just as strong from doing the same workouts?

Would you still say George Zimmerman shouldn't be charge as Guilty for doing the exact samething in the exact same scenario, that has a strong angry blonde white female instead of a black male, for the murder victim?

Blonde, brunette, red hair... whatever. If this giant, muscular, beast woman was smashing your head into the ground I'd atleast hear your story.

What bugs me is so many people have sided with Trayvon in spite of us not really knowing who started that fight. All we know is neighter man in that altercation was an angel.

 Zimmerman started the altercation by stalking him.   A frightened or violent response would be a normal thing in that context.  He also decided to ignore the advice from the authority figures he called when he dialed 911.  I really wish people whom disobeyed the law and authorities weren't allowed to carry guns.  As the legal aged adult I feel that he did far enough even before the last part of the altercation that blame should land squarely on his shoulders.  



Mr Puggsly on 03 February 2014
nitekrawler1285 said:

 Zimmerman started the altercation by stalking him.   A frightened or violent response would be a normal thing in that context.  He also decided to ignore the advice from the authority figures he called when he dialed 911.  I really wish people whom disobeyed the law and authorities weren't allowed to carry guns.  As the legal aged adult I feel that he did far enough even before the last part of the altercation that blame should land squarely on his shoulders.  

Following and trying to question someone doesn't mean you deserve to get your head smashed into the ground. Situations like that is why we're allowed to carry guns.

Zimmerman calling the police leads me to believe he had no intention of starting a fight or killing someone. Just my opinion ofcourse.



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nitekrawler1285 on 03 February 2014
Mr Puggsly said:
nitekrawler1285 said:

 Zimmerman started the altercation by stalking him.   A frightened or violent response would be a normal thing in that context.  He also decided to ignore the advice from the authority figures he called when he dialed 911.  I really wish people whom disobeyed the law and authorities weren't allowed to carry guns.  As the legal aged adult I feel that he did far enough even before the last part of the altercation that blame should land squarely on his shoulders.  

Following and trying to question someone doesn't mean you deserve to get your head smashed into the ground. Situations like that is why we're allowed to carry guns.

Zimmerman calling the police leads me to believe he had no intention of starting a fight or killing someone. Just my opinion ofcourse.

When you are not a member of the law you don't have the right to detain and question anyone period.  You inform the authorities of their supposed wrong doing and have them handle it.  He chose to take justice into his own hands. They told him they did not need him to follow the boy and that the police were already on the way.  

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/326700-full-transcript-zimmerman.html You can read it for yourself.  



shio on 03 February 2014
nitekrawler1285 said:

 Zimmerman started the altercation by stalking him.   A frightened or violent response would be a normal thing in that context.  He also decided to ignore the advice from the authority figures he called when he dialed 911.  I really wish people whom disobeyed the law and authorities weren't allowed to carry guns.  As the legal aged adult I feel that he did far enough even before the last part of the altercation that blame should land squarely on his shoulders.  

Zimmerman didn't disobey the law, he wasn't required to follow the advice of the dispatcher (and he didn't call 911, he called a non-emergency line).

Simply stalking shouldn't be deserving of getting beaten, especially if there wasn't a percieved threat of injury. Trayvon didn't seem to think there was a big threat, since he didn't run away (which he easily could have), or called 911 (which he easily could have), but instead the testemonies in court suggest that Trayvon actually initiated the confronting talk between both of them (supported by both Zimmerman and Trayvon's friend): 

- Zimmerman said that he had lost sight of Trayvon, but then Trayvon jumped out of a bush/tree and started talking to him.
- Trayvon's friend said that she heard on the phone the sound of wet grass (possibly Trayvon ducking and sliding/hitting grass/bushes?) and Trayvon whispering "get off", "get off" (perhaps to tell her to get off the phone call?), and finally hearing Trayvon confront Zimmerman with a question (I don't remember what it was, but I think it was "what are you doing?" or something along the lines)

Then we have a strong witness which claims that Trayvon was on top of Zimmerman, and that Trayvon was pummeling Zimmerman with punches, and not letting Zimmerman get away. All while hearing Zimmerman scream "help".

EDIT: The "help" screamed no one knows who actually said it, though. So disregard this bit.



http://i48.tinypic.com/120qaon.jpg
nitekrawler1285 on 04 February 2014
shio said:
nitekrawler1285 said:

 Zimmerman started the altercation by stalking him.   A frightened or violent response would be a normal thing in that context.  He also decided to ignore the advice from the authority figures he called when he dialed 911.  I really wish people whom disobeyed the law and authorities weren't allowed to carry guns.  As the legal aged adult I feel that he did far enough even before the last part of the altercation that blame should land squarely on his shoulders.  

Zimmerman didn't disobey the law, he wasn't required to follow the advice of the dispatcher (and he didn't call 911, he called a non-emergency line).

Simply stalking shouldn't be deserving of getting beaten, especially if there wasn't a percieved threat of injury. Trayvon didn't seem to think there was a big threat, since he didn't run away (which he easily could have), or called 911 (which he easily could have), but instead the testemonies in court suggest that Trayvon actually initiated the confronting talk between both of them (supported by both Zimmerman and Trayvon's friend): 

- Zimmerman said that he had lost sight of Trayvon, but then Trayvon jumped out of a bush/tree and started talking to him.
- Trayvon's friend said that she heard on the phone the sound of wet grass (possibly Trayvon ducking and sliding/hitting grass/bushes?) and Trayvon whispering "get off", "get off" (perhaps to tell her to get off the phone call?), and finally hearing Trayvon confront Zimmerman with a question (I don't remember what it was, but I think it was "what are you doing?" or something along the lines)

Then we have a strong witness which claims that Trayvon was on top of Zimmerman, and that Trayvon was pummeling Zimmerman with punches, and not letting Zimmerman get away. All while hearing Zimmerman scream "help".

So taking alternate routes home doesn't count as  trying to get away?  Note  Zimmerman lost him while trailing.  

He may not have been compelled to follow their directive but if he really didn't want to escalate anything there was no reason for him to ever leave the vehicle. He was already aware the authorities were on their way.  He just wanted to escalate the situation.  

Don't go stalking prey you can't beat if you don't want to get overcome.  



Mr Puggsly on 04 February 2014
nitekrawler1285 said:

When you are not a member of the law you don't have the right to detain and question anyone period.  You inform the authorities of their supposed wrong doing and have them handle it.  He chose to take justice into his own hands. They told him they did not need him to follow the boy and that the police were already on the way.  

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/326700-full-transcript-zimmerman.html You can read it for yourself.  

I'm not sure what context you're using the word detain. Eitherway, attempting to question someone doesn't mean you deserve a beating. Hence, in the eyes of the law being a bother doesn't justify violence.

Zimmerman didn't do anything wrong legally as far as I'm aware. Obviously Zimmerman's suspicion was raised from Trayvon running away. He followed Trayvon because he wanted to make sure the police found him.



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Mr Puggsly on 04 February 2014
nitekrawler1285 said:

So taking alternate routes home doesn't count as  trying to get away?  Note  Zimmerman lost him while trailing.  

He may not have been compelled to follow their directive but if he really didn't want to escalate anything there was no reason for him to ever leave the vehicle. He was already aware the authorities were on their way.  He just wanted to escalate the situation.  

Don't go stalking prey you can't beat if you don't want to get overcome.  


Some say he wanted to escalate the the situation. Although... making sure Trayvon didn't get away seems more logical to me considering he bothered to call the police.

If Zimmerman was "stalking prey," he wouldn't have called the police. The best advice from this is don't quickly resort to violence.



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