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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - NeoGAF: Wii U GPU 160 ALUs, 8 TMUs and 8 ROPs

JoeTheBro said:
oni-link said:

Wii U W101 vs Knack:

I actually prefer the latter!!!

Me too.

Or did you mix that up? ;)


Nope the latter being the 1st one so W101...I actually played Knack at the Stanford Mall Sony Style...on 4K TV as well.  It's okay MosDef doing nothing special that would blow my 360 games away like Banjo, let alone Wii U games like 3D world!! (though I have not played 3D world but still ;P)



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IT'S ALL ABOUT THE GAMES PEOPLE STOP FIGHTING!!!!!!



oni-link said:
JoeTheBro said:
oni-link said:

Wii U W101 vs Knack:

I actually prefer the latter!!!

Me too.

Or did you mix that up? ;)


Nope the latter being the 1st one so W101...I actually played Knack at the Stanford Mall Sony Style...on 4K TV as well.  It's okay MosDef doing nothing special that would blow my 360 games away like Banjo, let alone Wii U games like 3D world!! (though I have not played 3D world but still ;P)

http://www.reference.com/motif/science/former-vs-latter



oni-link said:

or like this

 

and this:


Don't forget the best looking Wii U game released so far:



curl-6 said:
oni-link said:

or like this

 

and this:


Don't forget the best looking Wii U game released so far:

OH HELL YEAH!!!!

Wii U games definitely LOOK way better than PS360 (note I stopped talking about specs and just how they look for me...it's all about the games)



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fatslob-:O said:
eyeofcore said:
oni-link said:
at this point I think no real Nintendo fan will care what specs the Wii U has!!! I for one don't care if it has the specs of a 15 year old Sega Dreamcast (I'm so tired of the BS about specs taking a rumor as fact) as long as it produces games as beautiful as SM3DW, X, Rayman Legends, Bayo2 etc!!! People shouldn't give a shit about which console has the biggest D!ck as long as it satisfies their needs no? Besides PC outshines any of the "big" 3's consoles anyday...so does Steam Machines!!!


I agree with you, I am here just refuting the obvious rumor and fallacy...

Fatslob forces a rumor as a fact yet the die shot, mm^2 available for GPU and other things say otherwise... He can't handle it.

Specs don't matter, Wii ruled for several years straight stomping Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 in sales and software sales and DS proved PSP and 3DS proved Vita are no match to the attractive design and games, for three years in a row, weakest console won in sales and software sales.

Hopefully the Wii U will continue the trend.

Die shots don't matter when a console is taking less than 35 watts. Deal with it! 

This rumor is partly backed up by the fact that it takes less than 35 watts. Deal with it once again. 

BTW what fallacy is there when you yourself can't back up your point with sources ? (Uh oh it really sounds like your reaching for that damage control LOL.)


so gamecube with average of 23watts is less powerfull then ps2 phat at 70 watts?



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oni-link said:

Wii U W101 vs Knack:

I actually prefer the latter!!!


Knack is nowhere as entertaining as W101, that much I can assure you lol.



fatslob-:O said:
fallen said:
ViktorBKK said:
F0X said:
ViktorBKK said:

The Wii U has more ram, thats it. Everywhere else it is lagging. You obviously do not understand the correlation between semiconductor lithography and power consumption.

Wii U : 40/45 nm & 40 Watts

PS360 Slim Versions: 40/45 nm & ~100 watts

Do the math.


Care to elaborate more? I'm led to believe that technology is supposed to become more effiecent over time.

Chip designs get more efficient over time, but engineers are not wizards. Especially when it comes to GPUs, where things are highly paralellized. You can improve a design and gain maybe 15% performance under the same thermal ceiling. You can't ever get 100%. Ever seen a 100W AMD card beat a 200W nVidia card? When both cards are in the same proccess node, it cannot happen. Also consider that the GPUs from all 3 current gen consoles, come from the same fab(TSMC).


not really true because smartphones are approaching ps3 power and they draw like a watt or two.

 

mind you, i believe the wii u is quite weak. just correcting you.

Not even close!


Not even close what?

 

Go look up the benches. Even something like Qaulcomm's latest SOC (I forget the model number, but it's been shipping for months) is as powerful as a 7800 GTX which is the GPU in PS3.

 

Let alone Project Logan, Nvidia's next mobile GPU, which they explicitely state is more powerful than PS3 (google Project Logan).

You may not see mobile games that look as good as PS360 yet, but that's for many reasons. The raw power is increasibgly there.



fatslob-:O said:
F0X said:
I hate to see this discussion devolve so much. :/

Let me rephrase something I've said earlier: I could choose to believe this information, and that would be fine. There's nothing wrong with putting stock in a good theory, especially when it has supporting evidence. Or I can wait for hard confirmation before coming to my own conclusions. Or I could simply not care at all and make my conclusions about the hardware based on whether or not it has games I desperately want to play.

And all of those viewpoints are logical in their own sense, so I'm left wondering why this thread is rapidly becoming devoid of respect, and by extension, respect for logical thought.

Dudes like eyeofcore in this is an eye sore to high tech discussion. If we keep ignorant people like him out we can solve the puzzle more easily without disruptions from him. Others like Teriol keep going on to damage control. 

It's devoid of respect because they can't respect an opposing view of another but yeah you should buy the consoles based on games not hardware. 


Yeah, there's too much needless damage control going on. The games being released for Wii U look good. Some of the recent third-party multiplats are passable (Assassin's Creed IV comes to mind). And even the digital scene is shaping up to be something good. Why the insecurity?

As the old joke goes, Wii U doesn't need more flops. :P



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forethought14 said:
fatslob-:O said:

Die shots don't matter when a console is taking less than 35 watts. Deal with it! 

This rumor is partly backed up by the fact that it takes less than 35 watts. Deal with it once again.

To be fair, 35W =/= to 160 shaders. I'm not denying 160, and not saying it's more than that, but the GPU could definitely be very low powered and also have higher amount of shaders than Wii U. If you take everything into consideration, Latte runs at roughly 18-ish watts. I stated this before, the Mobility Radeon HD 5650 is a 400 shader graphics card, clocked at 650mhz, 40nm process, and it runs from 15-19 watts depending on load. This is a mobile part, but it was originally based on the PC versions, so a similar idea could have easily applied to Latte. 15-19 watts is the enire graphics card, the GPU itself will run about 3-5 less watts then that. So in the end, Wii U could have very well have been a 400 shader part and still retain the 33-36W it runs at. Though, it's obviously not a 400 shader part. 

In my view about die size, I think there is obviously more to the GPU than meets the eye. No, I'm not being a "delusional fanboy" making it more than it is (it's not compared to the 5 billion transistor X1 silicon), but sizes shouldn't be completely ignored, it's simply too much logic for a conventional 160 shader GPU. If we take measurements in terms of transistors, Latte at 40nm is 156.21mm2 in size (the size of the GPU die), 40nm AMD GPUs are about 6.00 - 6.25 million transistors per mm2 (I averaged several AMD 40nm GPU in terms of size and transistors that were available, and found other averages and came up with that average, a good Google search does wonders), meaning Latte has roughly 717-756 million transistors without the eDRAM, and for comparison, Xenos is 232 million transistors without eDRAM. eDRAM in Latte is around 220 million transistors if it is indeed 40nm Renesas eDRAM, so total, Latte is close to 1 billion transistors. This means Latte has about 3x more transistors compared to Xenos, likely having a lot to do with more modern architecture, and other fixed-function silicon Nintendo decided to include in it. BC stuff is likely very small part of the GPU, so I'm pretty positive that it doesn't take up much room at all, a few mm2 at most. I don't know about what other people say, but a 160 shader part made up of 750 million transistors is not something to scoff at, most conventional 160 shader parts are much smaller than this. The HD 6450 has 160 shaders, 40nm but is 370 million trasnsistors. And to compare with a GPU with more shaders, 400 shader processor part HD 5670 at 40nm is 627 million transistors.

Can you please space your posts.  

There's just one thing that's a little funny about the mobility radeon hd 5650. The clock can range from anywhere from 450 to 650. The reported TMU's that we first thought was 16 so why does this part have 20 of them ? 

If the system had an hd 5650 the ports wouldn't be so troublesome! These inconsistencies bring me to suspect that it's using a desktop part! 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOA1WJ0tNT0

See that video right over there. That card is running battlefield 3 on HIGH settings at 44fps average OVER 720p! (This would suggest that the wii u IS SOMEWHAT on par with the X1 but real world results tell a very different story.) The wii u shouldn't even have a problem outing the ps360 in games like batman and why isn't SC blacklist a whole lot better ? Something tells me here that the card your mentioning might not be all consistent with how the wii u performed so far. BTW PC ports of console games are abysmally shit so don't even bring up the excuse that the PC has the more optimized verstions. (It's not even funny.) 

If the latte truly had 717-756 transistors then why does the system not suck up more than 35 watts ? (ignoring the mobile parts ofcourse.)

It wouldn't some cut down hd 5550 it would be a cutdown hd 5750! It would have much more than 400 shaders and even then the performance shown so far haven't being very consistent! 

Just so you know the hd 5550 also has 627 million transistors with a die space of 104mm^2. So adding some modifications such as the eDRAM while also disabling the shaders would lead me to believe that these list of components are very consistent with the observed phenomena so far.