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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Xbox one power scaling due to external updates! how listening to the internet has shot microsoft in the ass

kirby007 said:
JoeTheBro said:
kirby007 said:
JoeTheBro said:

Unless the XBONE is selling way less than both the PS4 and Wii U, devs will optimize their games as much as possible. First party games will still look better, but not by much.

Devs understand the cloud just fine and have been utilizing it this whole generation. If devs had good net code this gen, they will have good net code next gen.

Just like when playing multiplayer(which will be the main use of the cloud), you will be able to feel if you have a good connection or not. Also since practically every game that will use the cloud will be online multiplayer/mmos, you will be booted from the game, just like this gen.


so back to the point, where am i off base?

Thinking that the cloud will be used for graphical advancements creating the need for an offline version of the game.

how is it off base if its true?

Fact: a game will use 100% of the power of an xbox one
Fact: " for every Xbox One we're provisioning the CPU and storage equivalent of three Xbox Ones on the cloud. We're doing that flat out so that any game developer can assume that there's roughly three times the resources immediately available to their game, so they can build bigger, persistent levels that are more inclusive for players"

result: a xbox one connected to the cloud will have several benefits when computing

 

 

and a sidenote on the first part of thread title fact if the cloud server gets an upgrade a xbox connected to the cloud will have more external power available.

Are you serious? Thats just MS PR speech. The net just isn't quick enough for graphical improvments via the cloud. It might be in maybe 10-15 years time though maybe. If your clinging to that hope that the clouds will give the 3x the power bollocks then your gonna be mightily disapointed just like the DGPU nonsense. 



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kirby007 said:
attaboy said:
I'm a busy man and I don't have much time. Can somebody tell me just how doomed are we talking, here?

theoretically the One is 4times as powerfull as the ps4 under ideal cirsumstances.

but due to no allways online/latency/bandwith very few games are gonna profit from this

Lol! Today its the clouds, when that is debunked it will be the Esram. After that it'll be the audio chip etc. please stop this nonsense! PS4 is more powerful. No amount of clouds will change that. Let's move on!

if the clouds are so powerful then why does every PC gamer buy a powerful and expensive graphics card? The PC is ahead of the consoles? Why aren't they using the phantom clouds for power and graphics? It sometimes makes me wonder how desperate people are to convince themselves that the utter nonsense they are perpetuating is somehow true



Ashadian said:
kirby007 said:
attaboy said:
I'm a busy man and I don't have much time. Can somebody tell me just how doomed are we talking, here?

theoretically the One is 4times as powerfull as the ps4 under ideal cirsumstances.

but due to no allways online/latency/bandwith very few games are gonna profit from this

Lol! Today its the clouds, when that is debunked it will be the Esram. After that it'll be the audio chip etc. please stop this nonsense! PS4 is more powerful. No amount of clouds will change that. Let's move on!

if the clouds are so powerful then why does every PC gamer buy a powerful and expensive graphics card? The PC is ahead of the consoles? Why aren't they using the phantom clouds for power and graphics? It sometimes makes me wonder how desperate people are to convince themselves that the utter nonsense they are perpetuating is somehow true

how desperate are you trying to debunk it without proving anything? disproving something doesn't work that way.



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

Join the Prediction League http://www.vgchartz.com/predictions

Instead of seeking to convince others, we can be open to changing our own minds, and seek out information that contradicts our own steadfast point of view. Maybe it’ll turn out that those who disagree with you actually have a solid grasp of the facts. There’s a slight possibility that, after all, you’re the one who’s wrong.

kirby007 said:
Ashadian said:
kirby007 said:
attaboy said:
I'm a busy man and I don't have much time. Can somebody tell me just how doomed are we talking, here?

theoretically the One is 4times as powerfull as the ps4 under ideal cirsumstances.

but due to no allways online/latency/bandwith very few games are gonna profit from this

Lol! Today its the clouds, when that is debunked it will be the Esram. After that it'll be the audio chip etc. please stop this nonsense! PS4 is more powerful. No amount of clouds will change that. Let's move on!

if the clouds are so powerful then why does every PC gamer buy a powerful and expensive graphics card? The PC is ahead of the consoles? Why aren't they using the phantom clouds for power and graphics? It sometimes makes me wonder how desperate people are to convince themselves that the utter nonsense they are perpetuating is somehow true

how desperate are you trying to debunk it without proving anything? disproving something doesn't work that way.

I don't need to debunk anything. Your the one making empty claims based on MS PR spin. Your the one who has to prove it with actual evidence and not because some company says so. Its common sense to realise that real time graphics and power are impossible via cloud computing for the X180. I have an 100MB connection but i've never seen it hit 100MB download yet. Not even 50mb a second!



I had to write a post in an other thread that fit in here perfectly which is basicly a short summary of the vision i suspect microsoft has:

Regarding things like latency and bandwidth are an possible bottleneck now doesn't mean they will be next year or the year after and so on. So yes the numbers from the hardware within the Xbox seem and possibly are lower then that of its competitor! That doesn't mean it will stay less strong because if the cloud gets developed for properly it will increase the hardwares potential without increasing its internal numbers! which in my mind is a big innovation it could even mean the Xbox one will grow with the technological developments and not lag so much behind proper gaming rigs as every console before it has done!

this means that even little bits currently can be done on cloud and the future developments will allow it to do more later in its lifecycle and posisbly extend the cycle!



 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

Join the Prediction League http://www.vgchartz.com/predictions

Instead of seeking to convince others, we can be open to changing our own minds, and seek out information that contradicts our own steadfast point of view. Maybe it’ll turn out that those who disagree with you actually have a solid grasp of the facts. There’s a slight possibility that, after all, you’re the one who’s wrong.

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ethomaz said:
Firstly the Cloud can't be used to render/compute any part of the game that is reactive... so 90% of the code can't be done in Cloud... only parallel non-reactive code can be done on Cloud.

Second... nothing changed... even with always online the dev will need to have a backup code that works offline... the game will have to run even if you are offline.

Cloud won't give you more power or graphics... it will enhancement the experience with better non-reactive simulations data. And nothing done on Cloud can't be done in a dedicated server... there arw nothing new with the Cloud because Cloud are a cluster of dedicated servers.



wait that is true for games like FPS with SP.... what we are talking here is online games with persitant world or a multitude of games that do not need reactive graphics... turned based online RPGS,  I could see a great "pokemon like" game with kick ass battle rendering.... a multitude of games do not need crasy physics engine....

I don't expect the next gear of war to use cloud a lot... but why not a bunch of RPG, and other static game graphic that are online only... cloud computing is used already for a shit load of apps today.... it's not like it is anything new... 90% of my phone apps that need a connection use cloud computing or some cloud based service with almost no latency and close to 0 issues even on edge network....

yeah nothing is new with cloud... the only new part is the massive amount of it being available for a closed network/system with on the fly resource attribution and not a static amount of dedicated servers... this is a first in gaming history.... even EA or any big developers don't have that amount of load balancing capable servers and certainly not that globaly widespread which can only be a plus in the end for everybody...

cloud computing and cloud everything is the future, anybody doubting that is a fool... now I agree that anybody expecting a 300% graphic improvement through cloud computing is a dman fool too.... but their is much more to it than just graphics for the usual games they are many ways to exploit it...



Ashadian said:
kirby007 said:
Ashadian said:
kirby007 said:
attaboy said:
I'm a busy man and I don't have much time. Can somebody tell me just how doomed are we talking, here?

theoretically the One is 4times as powerfull as the ps4 under ideal cirsumstances.

but due to no allways online/latency/bandwith very few games are gonna profit from this

Lol! Today its the clouds, when that is debunked it will be the Esram. After that it'll be the audio chip etc. please stop this nonsense! PS4 is more powerful. No amount of clouds will change that. Let's move on!

if the clouds are so powerful then why does every PC gamer buy a powerful and expensive graphics card? The PC is ahead of the consoles? Why aren't they using the phantom clouds for power and graphics? It sometimes makes me wonder how desperate people are to convince themselves that the utter nonsense they are perpetuating is somehow true

how desperate are you trying to debunk it without proving anything? disproving something doesn't work that way.

I don't need to debunk anything. Your the one making empty claims based on MS PR spin. Your the one who has to prove it with actual evidence and not because some company says so. Its common sense to realise that real time graphics and power are impossible via cloud computing for the X180. I have an 100MB connection but i've never seen it hit 100MB download yet. Not even 50mb a second!



However you are only basing your argument one way. The way you want to see it work. It can work many different ways then what you have stated. PEACE



PS4 Architect Mark Cerny: 'Cloud won't work well to boost graphics'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCVplpC1YXY
or
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=631761



It's obvious that with good bandwidth and low ping, the cloud, just like dedicated servers, can run physic, AI and most of the logic parts and interactions of a game, particularly those of parts of the game world that aren't directly interacting with the player, but with careful optimizations and accepting some limitations and some lag, also the interaction with the player (just like it already does in MMOGs), but the graphics engine must run locally.



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW! 
 


I've got 50ms ping to a few CDN endpoints, not bad latency for gaming.