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Nintendo's WII -U will win the Holiday Season and the Next Gen IF

Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nintendo's WII -U will win the Holiday Season and the Next Gen IF

Will Nintendo win the Next Gen if they Bring the Price of the Deluxe Edition of Wii U down to $250.00 for the Holidays?

Yes. Definitely. 92 18.36%
 
No. Definitely not. 173 34.53%
 
It would be suicide for N... 86 17.17%
 
It would be the Best Move... 55 10.98%
 
Still too early to tell. 95 18.96%
 
Total:501
Soundwave said:

That's your opinion only. I expect more from something 7 years newer than an XBox 360, I expect it to absolutely demolish a 7-year-older piece of kit and that's obviously not the case.


Sorry, but that's quite literally not "my opinion only". The tech is sound. The GPU is modern. The amount of RAM is perfectly fine, it's just not quite as high as what the competition will have. You claim that it should "absolutely demolish" the Xbox360, yet you are talking about games that are literally either unfinished demos, are straight ports from said console, or are merely first generation software (which not once in the entirety of game history has ever produced the best looking software for any single console). Wait until we see something like the new Zelda before you go claiming that the Wii U is more or less no better than last gen.



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S.T.A.G.E. said:
 


Yes, according to history Nintendo did depend on third parties, but they ruled them with an unwavering attitude. They couldn't spread to Sega because Sega during the Genesis era couldn't spread their marketshare until the SNES era and had to rely solely on first party which made everything from action games to first party sports titles just to measure up. Eventually when the Playstation and Saturn came there was alternative hardware with CD technology and Nintendo was afraid of piracy so they stuck with discs. Third party wanted Discs, especially since the trend with CD roms was already the norm on PC in the mid 90's. Nintendo stuck with cartidges and sealed their fate and lost half of their marketshare because of it.

Pachter has not been wrong about all things Nintendo, and obviously the man is not perfect, but he has to have done something right as a Wedbush analyst or else he wouldn't have a job. 

I'll bet the Wii U without third parties will struggle to reach forty million. The reason I say this is because without third party the first parties audience doesn't grow exponentially, it generally stays the same. The Wii's case was widely exceptional.

If you have paid attention to the sales of hardware, all consoles that lacked third party have had a hard time winning any generation.


A) The Wii had a lot of third party support. A lot. It just didn't get the lion's share of major multiplat titles the other HD consoles were getting.

 

B) Pachter is a joke, as is referencing or citing him in any video game discussion. Just because the man is a legit business analyst, does not mean that he actually knows the first, second, third or even fourth thing about video games, the video games industry, the history of said industry, or gamers themselves. Because with most things he says he clearly doesn't, and he contradicts himself (aka goes back on shit he previously predicted) all the time. The dude is a joke, and the only reason any of us know him is because for some unknown reason GameTrailes whores him out. Had it not been for GT, none of us would even know his name.

C) Wii U didn't lack for third party support at launch, in fact it was quite strong then. It has dried up since because of the sales slump of the system, which ironically was caused by the software drought. Certain third party companies seem to expect Nintendo to sell their hardware with their own games (Which they do, if only those games had come out sooner), but they don't realize that, as you yourself stated, third party expands the potential audience/customer base of a given console. Third party devs providing stronger support for a system could be considered a business investment in making the potential customer base of that console stronger in the end, which would result in greater net sales for their own games over time. But some companies, specifically EA, don't seem to see it that way, which is their own short-sightedness coming to bear, and no idictment on the system itself. The sales of the console WILL pick up, and when they do, there is no legitimate excuse on earth for most third party devs to not at least provide cheaper-than-they-let-on-to-make multi-console ports for the system, at the very least.



DevilRising said:

[...]

B) Pachter is a joke, as is referencing or citing him in any video game discussion.

[...]

 

How dare you blaspheme against Teh Analyst God and doubt His Holy Word!

You'll burn in hell, YOU INFIDEL!!!



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")

A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.

TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW!

        

Alby_da_Wolf said:

^^

@bolded: this. That's why Ninty should stick to its usual business model and leave Sony's and MS' ones to them: unless they commit horrible mistakes, each model works well for each one of them, but it doesn't really work for the others. BTW Ninty's model enjoys the bigger profit margin, but MS and Sony know that copying it wouldn't work as well for them, to approach Ninty's profit margin their only way is to refine their own models to improve efficiency and avoid wastes, and to boost 1st party development, but not up to Ninty level, otherwise they'd scare 3st parties away.


what do you mean up to Ninty level? Because i would argue that SOny has actually boosted 1st party development a lot in the past few years. Hell i would argue that PS3 had just as much 1st party games as Wii, it probably has more since SOny is still supporting PS3 with games while preparing for 4 and doing somethings(KZ:M,Tearaway) for Vita. While Ninty dropped WIi pretty much right after Skyward Sword



oniyide said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

^^

@bolded: this. That's why Ninty should stick to its usual business model and leave Sony's and MS' ones to them: unless they commit horrible mistakes, each model works well for each one of them, but it doesn't really work for the others. BTW Ninty's model enjoys the bigger profit margin, but MS and Sony know that copying it wouldn't work as well for them, to approach Ninty's profit margin their only way is to refine their own models to improve efficiency and avoid wastes, and to boost 1st party development, but not up to Ninty level, otherwise they'd scare 3st parties away.


what do you mean up to Ninty level? Because i would argue that SOny has actually boosted 1st party development a lot in the past few years. Hell i would argue that PS3 had just as much 1st party games as Wii, it probably has more since SOny is still supporting PS3 with games while preparing for 4 and doing somethings(KZ:M,Tearaway) for Vita. While Ninty dropped WIi pretty much right after Skyward Sword

I mean same level when supporting the console full steam and the same level of measures taken to sell tens million copies of its strongest games, including heavy bundling, like Ninty did, 7 Ninty games sold more than 20M copies on Wii, many of them were heavily bundled (but they sold also standalone copies, some fewer, some others more), we can say Ninty "militarily" occupies the Top 10 on its systems. It works for Ninty, but it would be a disaster for Sony and MS.

Just compare them:

http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=&publisher=&platform=Wii&genre=&minSales=0&results=200

http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=&publisher=&platform=PS3&genre=&minSales=0&results=200



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")

A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.

TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW!

        

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Alby_da_Wolf said:
oniyide said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

^^

@bolded: this. That's why Ninty should stick to its usual business model and leave Sony's and MS' ones to them: unless they commit horrible mistakes, each model works well for each one of them, but it doesn't really work for the others. BTW Ninty's model enjoys the bigger profit margin, but MS and Sony know that copying it wouldn't work as well for them, to approach Ninty's profit margin their only way is to refine their own models to improve efficiency and avoid wastes, and to boost 1st party development, but not up to Ninty level, otherwise they'd scare 3st parties away.


what do you mean up to Ninty level? Because i would argue that SOny has actually boosted 1st party development a lot in the past few years. Hell i would argue that PS3 had just as much 1st party games as Wii, it probably has more since SOny is still supporting PS3 with games while preparing for 4 and doing somethings(KZ:M,Tearaway) for Vita. While Ninty dropped WIi pretty much right after Skyward Sword

I mean same level when supporting the console full steam and the same level of measures taken to sell tens million copies of its strongest games, including heavy bundling, like Ninty did, 7 Ninty games sold more than 20M copies on Wii, many of them were heavily bundled (but they sold also standalone copies, some fewer, some others more), we can say Ninty "militarily" occupies the Top 10 on its systems. It works for Ninty, but it would be a disaster for Sony and MS.

Just compare them:

http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=&publisher=&platform=Wii&genre=&minSales=0&results=200

http://www.vgchartz.com/gamedb/?name=&publisher=&platform=PS3&genre=&minSales=0&results=200

I disagree, Wii is the exception and not the rule IMHO. How much of Ninty's games were really heavily bundled? WiiSports, Resort, NSMBWii?(not sure about that one) and MKart which was bundled long after it was already doing great. Thats not really that much different than PS3 bundles which Sony did do a few for their own games. GT5, Uncharted1?2,3, God of War, there was the Move bundle that came with Sports Champions, Infamous had a bundle. little big planet. So you cant say that Sony doesnt do it, hell they probably do it more.

Not sure what sales prove. Two different products selling to two different demographs, One blue ocean one red, one cheap one wasnt, and its Nintendo they have the advantage of being around for much longer. Wii sold more so it sells more games. Doesnt mean that Sony didnt support it full steam, hell considering that Ninty pretty dropped Wii sometime ago i would say that they didnt support Wii full steam.



oniyide said:
 

I disagree, Wii is the exception and not the rule IMHO. How much of Ninty's games were really heavily bundled? WiiSports, Resort, NSMBWii?(not sure about that one) and MKart which was bundled long after it was already doing great. Thats not really that much different than PS3 bundles which Sony did do a few for their own games. GT5, Uncharted1?2,3, God of War, there was the Move bundle that came with Sports Champions, Infamous had a bundle. little big planet. So you cant say that Sony doesnt do it, hell they probably do it more.

Not sure what sales prove. Two different products selling to two different demographs, One blue ocean one red, one cheap one wasnt, and its Nintendo they have the advantage of being around for much longer. Wii sold more so it sells more games. Doesnt mean that Sony didnt support it full steam, hell considering that Ninty pretty dropped Wii sometime ago i would say that they didnt support Wii full steam.

NVM.



Here are my thoughts.

WiiU sales will improve with a lower price point and more games. I will be seen as a better value than either Sony or Microsoft's new consoles --$160 to $260 cheaper to actually be ready to play a game.

The XB1 and PS4 are similarly architectured PC like devices. They will eventually find themselves competing with gamers against PCs.

Nintendo's biggest sellers come early next year --Brawl and Kart. People forget how many copies of Mario Kart Wii sold. And relatively few of those were bundled. If those don't move systems, nothing will.

No system will ever sell like the Wii did. GameStop predicted a smaller generation even before the WiiU's slow launch.

The only third party which has pulled away from the WiiU entirely is EA. And there is reason to think it had more to do with Origin than with slow sales.

Nothing is guaranteeing strong, continual sales for the XB1 and PS4. The arguments that people make regarding the different world facing the WiiU -- from competion from other places to global economic challenges-- also hold true for other consoles, and they are move expensive.

A major manufacturing snafu by Sony or Microsoft (akin to the RROD) could spell disaster since those two machines are so similar.

Game stores will push the new machines because managers have been bribed with consoles and games. Nintnedo does not do that.

Nintnedo needs to do more advertising -- not just on Nick and Cartoon Network.

Systems that were essentially DoA are ones that never sold. Things like the Jaguar or the Virual Boy. The WiiU has already outsold th Colecovision lifetime.



      


I am Mario.


I like to jump around, and would lead a fairly serene and aimless existence if it weren't for my friends always getting into trouble. I love to help out, even when it puts me at risk. I seem to make friends with people who just can't stay out of trouble.

Wii Friend Code: 1624 6601 1126 1492

NNID: Mike_INTV

mike_intellivision said:
Here are my thoughts.

WiiU sales will improve with a lower price point and more games. I will be seen as a better value than either Sony or Microsoft's new consoles --$160 to $260 cheaper to actually be ready to play a game.

The XB1 and PS4 are similarly architectured PC like devices. They will eventually find themselves competing with gamers against PCs.

Nintendo's biggest sellers come early next year --Brawl and Kart. People forget how many copies of Mario Kart Wii sold. And relatively few of those were bundled. If those don't move systems, nothing will.

No system will ever sell like the Wii did. GameStop predicted a smaller generation even before the WiiU's slow launch.

The only third party which has pulled away from the WiiU entirely is EA. And there is reason to think it had more to do with Origin than with slow sales.

Nothing is guaranteeing strong, continual sales for the XB1 and PS4. The arguments that people make regarding the different world facing the WiiU -- from competion from other places to global economic challenges-- also hold true for other consoles, and they are move expensive.

A major manufacturing snafu by Sony or Microsoft (akin to the RROD) could spell disaster since those two machines are so similar.

Game stores will push the new machines because managers have been bribed with consoles and games. Nintnedo does not do that.

Nintnedo needs to do more advertising -- not just on Nick and Cartoon Network.

Systems that were essentially DoA are ones that never sold. Things like the Jaguar or the Virual Boy. The WiiU has already outsold th Colecovision lifetime.


The PS1 and PS2 outsold the Wii.



Dropping the price of the Wii U any further this year would do Nintendo no good. Their proposition this holiday is an 8th gen system and a game (and a guaranteed good one if you get the Wind Waker HD bundle) for $100 less than the next cheapest console by itself. That's a pretty good value, and they're unlikely to get many more customers that they wouldn't already if they chopped off another $50 this year, and it would hurt their bottom line more.

As people in this thread have already said, the Wii U's biggest handicap is the software drought and not the price, and that's getting rectified this fall. We'll see how the sales look after the big games have dropped.