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Forums - General Discussion - A Guide to doing Religion Wrong!

 

Do you Find this comic offensive?

No, it's fair and accurate 19 43.18%
 
Yes, it is unfair and inaccurate 8 18.18%
 
Only a little offensive, ... 9 20.45%
 
I will kill you for drawing mohammed! 2 4.55%
 
Other (please explain) 6 13.64%
 
Total:44
antfromtashkent said:
I am not going to name names but some people here seem to think just because they use obscure words it makes them seem smarter. The anti religion rants on the internet are now bordering hostile.

Just because some extremist religious groups are up to what they have been up to for thousands of years and spew hate, all other religious are lumped with them and are treated as villains.

Some "Anti-Religion Superhero Types" feel like they are doing the right thing by putting down peoples beliefs while becoming the very same thing they are railing against. What a beautiful world we live in.

Just wanted to briefly address this second point.

Has a single person mentioned anything in this thread about extremism? No one has said anything along the lines of all religion does is promote flying airplanes into towers and blowing up ophanages.

Did you even bother reading any of the thread at all?

ALL religions share a common theme - faith. This is the most vile word in the dictionary. It promotes delusion and irrationality. The pervasiveness of people using this term as a building block is extremely profound. Faith is not an argument for belief. It's actually asserting that you have no argument for your belief at all.

This is why I detest religion. It practices indoctrination of children through dogmatic principles. It's essentially coercion. 



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dsgrue3 said:
antfromtashkent said:
I am not going to name names but some people here seem to think just because they use obscure words it makes them seem smarter. The anti religion rants on the internet are now bordering hostile.

Just because some extremist religious groups are up to what they have been up to for thousands of years and spew hate, all other religious are lumped with them and are treated as villains.

Some "Anti-Religion Superhero Types" feel like they are doing the right thing by putting down peoples beliefs while becoming the very same thing they are railing against. What a beautiful world we live in.

Just wanted to briefly address this second point.

Has a single person mentioned anything in this thread about extremism? No one has said anything along the lines of all religion does is promote flying airplanes into towers and blowing up ophanages.

Did you even bother reading any of the thread at all?

ALL religions share a common theme - faith. This is the most vile word in the dictionary. It promotes delusion and irrationality. The pervasiveness of people using this term as a building block is extremely profound. Faith is not an argument for belief. It's actually asserting that you have no argument for your belief at all.

This is why I detest religion. It practices indoctrination of children through dogmatic principles. It's essentially coercion. 

Extremism doesn't only mean flying planes into buildings... It could mean extreme hate for another group of people that don't share their beliefs and forcing people to their faith  (as the comic showed). As hard as it is for you to apparently understand, most religious people are actually quite rational and don't force their beliefs down other people's throats. I think that part of religion is evolution of understanding. It came a long way from the witch trials as you may see.

 

I find it sickening that you choose to put other peoples beliefs and dare I say it... way of life with seemingly no provocation at all. An once again my point is bolded.



antfromtashkent said:
dsgrue3 said:

Just wanted to briefly address this second point.

Has a single person mentioned anything in this thread about extremism? No one has said anything along the lines of all religion does is promote flying airplanes into towers and blowing up ophanages.

Did you even bother reading any of the thread at all?

ALL religions share a common theme - faith. This is the most vile word in the dictionary. It promotes delusion and irrationality. The pervasiveness of people using this term as a building block is extremely profound. Faith is not an argument for belief. It's actually asserting that you have no argument for your belief at all.

This is why I detest religion. It practices indoctrination of children through dogmatic principles. It's essentially coercion. 

Extremism doesn't only mean flying planes into buildings... It could mean extreme hate for another group of people that don't share their beliefs and forcing people to their faith  (as the comic showed). As hard as it is for you to apparently understand, most religious people are actually quite rational and don't force their beliefs down other people's throats. I think that part of religion is evolution of understanding. It came a long way from the witch trials as you may see.

 

I find it sickening that you choose to put other peoples beliefs and dare I say it... way of life with seemingly no provocation at all. An once again my point is bolded.

No one addressed extremism in any capacity. What is so difficult to understand about that? What has been addressed is fundamentalism and mainstream religion.

I have no issue with religious people. It isn't their fault they were indoctrinated from a young age. But it's time to admit it...and stop propagating that ritualistic coercion. That's where I come in. To point out that from the perspective of someone who was not indoctrinated by it, it seems laughably absurd. The logical position is that of a skeptic and not to be credulous.

I will continue to speak ill of nonsensical things, but religion is a very pernicious beast. I share hatred for astrology, ghosts, witchcraft, voodoo, and anything else devoid of evidence or rationalism.  But notice these other things aren't systems of belief where if one doesn't abide by them they go to hell, so there is much less influence.

No provocation? Amusing that you pretend to understand my life. Needless to say, you're incorrect in that assumption.



dsgrue3 said:
antfromtashkent said:
dsgrue3 said:

 

3. No one addressed extremism in any capacity. What is so difficult to understand about that? What has been addressed is fundamentalism and mainstream religion.

1. I have no issue with religious people. It isn't their fault they were indoctrinated from a young age. But it's time to admit it...and stop propagating that ritualistic coercion. That's where I come in. To point out that from the perspective of someone who was not indoctrinated by it, it seems laughably absurd. The logical position is that of a skeptic and not to be credulous.

2. I will continue to speak ill of nonsensical things, but religion is a very pernicious beast. I share hatred for astrology, ghosts, witchcraft, voodoo, and anything else devoid of evidence or rationalism.  But notice these other things aren't systems of belief where if one doesn't abide by them they go to hell, so there is much less influence.

1. No provocation? Amusing that you pretend to understand my life. Needless to say, you're incorrect in that assumption.

1. This is your first post in this thread:

"40% of Americans believe the Sun revolves around the Earth and God supplanted humans on Earth less than 10,000 years ago.

And you wonder why the non-religious have a problem with these scientifically illiterate simpletons.

It is DESTRUCTIVE. There is no "hey man, let anyone believe what they want." Then what the fuck is the point of education? Aren't we supposed to be passing off KNOWLEDGE, not BULLSHIT? Oh you believe that the light spectrum is only 3 wavelengths? Fascinating, but wrong. Do you understand yet?

Time to get a clue and stop purporting unsubstantiated belief systems as dogma."

I dont know what happend in your life that made you the way that you are and I dont care. All I care about is that you are spewing hate. Did you notice that I did not bring up my beliefs yet?

2. Thats fine, that your choice. I'm just trying to show you that you are being hipocritical.

3. Ok, we are not getting anywhere here so you can keep your shallow definition of extremism. To me it's anything to do with forcing religion on someone else, and that is clearly in the comic.

PS: Your second and fourth paragraphs are contradictory, even if you are just implying.



antfromtashkent said:
dsgrue3 said:

3. No one addressed extremism in any capacity. What is so difficult to understand about that? What has been addressed is fundamentalism and mainstream religion.

1. I have no issue with religious people. It isn't their fault they were indoctrinated from a young age. But it's time to admit it...and stop propagating that ritualistic coercion. That's where I come in. To point out that from the perspective of someone who was not indoctrinated by it, it seems laughably absurd. The logical position is that of a skeptic and not to be credulous.

2. I will continue to speak ill of nonsensical things, but religion is a very pernicious beast. I share hatred for astrology, ghosts, witchcraft, voodoo, and anything else devoid of evidence or rationalism.  But notice these other things aren't systems of belief where if one doesn't abide by them they go to hell, so there is much less influence.

1. No provocation? Amusing that you pretend to understand my life. Needless to say, you're incorrect in that assumption.

1. This is your first post in this thread:

"40% of Americans believe the Sun revolves around the Earth and God supplanted humans on Earth less than 10,000 years ago.

And you wonder why the non-religious have a problem with these scientifically illiterate simpletons.

It is DESTRUCTIVE. There is no "hey man, let anyone believe what they want." Then what the fuck is the point of education? Aren't we supposed to be passing off KNOWLEDGE, not BULLSHIT? Oh you believe that the light spectrum is only 3 wavelengths? Fascinating, but wrong. Do you understand yet?

Time to get a clue and stop purporting unsubstantiated belief systems as dogma."

I dont know what happend in your life that made you the way that you are and I dont care. All I care about is that you are spewing hate. Did you notice that I did not bring up my beliefs yet?

2. Thats fine, that your choice. I'm just trying to show you that you are being hipocritical.

3. Ok, we are not getting anywhere here so you can keep your shallow definition of extremism. To me it's anything to do with forcing religion on someone else, and that is clearly in the comic.

PS: Your second and fourth paragraphs are contradictory, even if you are just implying.

So your position is that all religion is extreme? If so, then I share that sentiment. Otherwise, I'm not sure where you're coming from. 

Well, I could have made it clearer. I take no issues with non-fundamentlist religious people - the ones who don't take things verbatim, understand that allegories exist, and apply them appropriately to have some sense of cogence with the natural world. The fundamentalists should really be met with nothing but mockery. I do take issue with these, but only for spreading nonsense. If nonsense has popularity, people tend to commit the argumentum ad populum fallacy.

It's difficult to fault children for credulity, so I don't want to blame the people themselves, but ultimately the people are at fault. You can't blame the dogma itself because that's nonsensical. The primary issue is that this system of thought is taught to children. It's almost like racism. They hear their parents saying these things and perceive them as normal or acceptable. They see other adults as well and it allows it to happen without challenge. It's really quite frightening to me.

I'm sorry, how exactly have I been hypocritical? If you'll notice, I have no belief system.



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dsgrue3 said:
antfromtashkent said:
dsgrue3 said:

 

 

So your position is that all religion is extreme? If so, then I share that sentiment. Otherwise, I'm not sure where you're coming from. 

No. There are religions that promote nothing but love for one another so that the direct opposite of forcing people to your faith. Perhaps its not your vew of extremism that is shallow, but your view of religion and faith.

Well, I could have made it clearer. I take no issues with non-fundamentlist religious people - the ones who don't take things verbatim, understand that allegories exist, and apply them appropriately to have some sense of cogence with the natural world. The fundamentalists should really be met with nothing but mockery. I do take issue with these, but only for spreading nonsense. If nonsense has popularity, people tend to commit the argumentum ad populum fallacy.

I dissagree with the bolded because this is the same narrowminded 3rd grade "HE DID IT FIRST" mentality that prevents understanding and promotes hate.

It's difficult to fault children for credulity, so I don't want to blame the people themselves, but ultimately the people are at fault. You can't blame the dogma itself because that's nonsensical. The primary issue is that this system of thought is taught to children. It's almost like racism. They hear their parents saying these things and perceive them as normal or acceptable. They see other adults as well and it allows it to happen without challenge. It's really quite frightening to me.

Not sure what this has to do with anything.... but it's your belief understanding

I'm sorry, how exactly have I been hypocritical? If you'll notice, I have no belief system.

See my 3 grade mentality comment





antfromtashkent said:
dsgrue3 said:

So your position is that all religion is extreme? If so, then I share that sentiment. Otherwise, I'm not sure where you're coming from. 

No. There are religions that promote nothing but love for one another so that the direct opposite of forcing people to your faith. Perhaps its not your vew of extremism that is shallow, but your view of religion and faith.

Well, I could have made it clearer. I take no issues with non-fundamentlist religious people - the ones who don't take things verbatim, understand that allegories exist, and apply them appropriately to have some sense of cogence with the natural world. The fundamentalists should really be met with nothing but mockery. I do take issue with these, but only for spreading nonsense. If nonsense has popularity, people tend to commit the argumentum ad populum fallacy.

I dissagree with the bolded because this is the same narrowminded 3rd grade "HE DID IT FIRST" mentality that prevents understanding and promotes hate.

It's difficult to fault children for credulity, so I don't want to blame the people themselves, but ultimately the people are at fault. You can't blame the dogma itself because that's nonsensical. The primary issue is that this system of thought is taught to children. It's almost like racism. They hear their parents saying these things and perceive them as normal or acceptable. They see other adults as well and it allows it to happen without challenge. It's really quite frightening to me.

Not sure what this has to do with anything.... but it's your belief understanding

I'm sorry, how exactly have I been hypocritical? If you'll notice, I have no belief system.

See my 3 grade mentality comment

 

I'm sorry, but you are not being realistic here. There is a basis to every religion and that is god. So suggesting religions only teach love for one another is total bullshit. That is among many other teachings of the religion itself. You also failed to address the indoctrination of children. So even if I abandon all of my senses, you're still left with people forcing religion down their own children's throats.

So if someone walks up to you and says the moon is made of cheese, you would respect that position? Just trying to follow your logic or lack thereof on the matter here. Furthmore, your third grader analogy does not make any sense at all. There is no trading of mockery here. Simply one side in reality, the other not so much.

Since I just destroyed your analogy as it wasn't suitable at all to the content, I still fail to see any hypocrisy here. 

If you're suggesting the indoctrination of children doesn't happen, I'm extremely confused. Have you ever been to a church?

After your reply, I'm left totally baffled. It's as though I just witnessed an expose on how to avoid responding to someone else's post by using nonsense.



dsgrue3 said:
antfromtashkent said:
I SAID:


There are religions that promote nothing but love for one another so that the direct opposite of forcing people to your faith.

 

I'm sorry, but you are not being realistic here. There is a basis to every religion and that is god. So suggesting religions only teach love for one another is total bullshit. That is among many other teachings of the religion itself. You also failed to address the indoctrination of children. So even if I abandon all of my senses, you're still left with people forcing religion down their own children's throats.

I left the quote you're reffering to. I did not say ALL religions. Stop lumping all faiths together. Are you saying that all children that are born into a religious home are magically turned into religious zombies? Dont be ridiculous. As I said before (a couple of times now) there are reasonable, educated religious homes that let their childred deside what to belive.

So if someone walks up to you and says the moon is made of cheese, you would respect that position? Just trying to follow your logic or lack thereof on the matter here. Furthmore, your third grader analogy does not make any sense at all. There is no trading of mockery here. Simply one side in reality, the other not so much.

The 3rd grader analogy is the vicious circle of hate that is produced by individuals like you that push people to defend their faith to you because you are not satisfied with their way of life. This is not productive and just fuel to the fire for no reason. 

EX: 

3rd Grader 1: God is great.

3rd Gradern 2: Dont be stupid

3rd Grader 1: SHUT UP! THE DEVIL MADE YOU BELIEVE THAT!

3rd Grader 2: WERE MADE OF STARDUST!

Teacher: Come on boys

3rd Grader 2: HE STARTED IT!

Get it?

Since I just destroyed your analogy as it wasn't suitable at all to the content, I still fail to see any hypocrisy here. 

If you're suggesting the indoctrination of children doesn't happen, I'm extremely confused. Have you ever been to a church?

After your reply, I'm left totally baffled. It's as though I just witnessed an expose on how to avoid responding to someone else's post by using nonsense.

Hopefully that cleared it up for you.  Once again not all religious people are thesame. You said you dont have a problem with some religious people and then you lump them all together again.





antfromtashkent said:

dsgrue3 said:
 

I'm sorry, but you are not being realistic here. There is a basis to every religion and that is god. So suggesting religions only teach love for one another is total bullshit. That is among many other teachings of the religion itself. You also failed to address the indoctrination of children. So even if I abandon all of my senses, you're still left with people forcing religion down their own children's throats.

I left the quote you're reffering to. I did not say ALL religions. Stop lumping all faiths together. Are you saying that all children that are born into a religious home are magically turned into religious zombies? Dont be ridiculous. As I said before (a couple of times now) there are reasonable, educated religious homes that let their childred deside what to belive.

So if someone walks up to you and says the moon is made of cheese, you would respect that position? Just trying to follow your logic or lack thereof on the matter here. Furthmore, your third grader analogy does not make any sense at all. There is no trading of mockery here. Simply one side in reality, the other not so much.

The 3rd grader analogy is the vicious circle of hate that is produced by individuals like you that push people to defend their faith to you because you are not satisfied with their way of life. This is not productive and just fuel to the fire for no reason. 

EX: 

3rd Grader 1: God is great.

3rd Gradern 2: Dont be stupid

3rd Grader 1: SHUT UP! THE DEVIL MADE YOU BELIEVE THAT!

3rd Grader 2: WERE MADE OF STARDUST!

Teacher: Come on boys

3rd Grader 2: HE STARTED IT!

Get it?

Since I just destroyed your analogy as it wasn't suitable at all to the content, I still fail to see any hypocrisy here. 

If you're suggesting the indoctrination of children doesn't happen, I'm extremely confused. Have you ever been to a church?

After your reply, I'm left totally baffled. It's as though I just witnessed an expose on how to avoid responding to someone else's post by using nonsense.

Hopefully that cleared it up for you.  Once again not all religious people are thesame. You said you dont have a problem with some religious people and then you lump them all together again.

 

I'll try and be constructive about this, but you're making it very difficult when you miss the content by such a wide margin.

It does not matter if I say religion or one religion or a few religions, the point remains the same. No religion teaches just love everyone; there are other aspects of the religion that are taught and accepted. To deny this is to deny the entire concept of religion itself.

Yes, I am suggesting that the majority of the time religion IS being introduced through coercive measures to the spawn of other religious people. This is evidenced by the Christian predilection in the US, the Muslim one in the Middle East, the Hindu one in India. Furthermore, when you analyze the subsets of the non-majority religions, there is no conversion...the muslims in the US have children who become muslim as opposed to Christian. I wonder why? Indoctrination, plain to see...you need only open your eyes.

When their faith is destructive to not only myself, but to others (as well as their own children) it must be challenged. Why are we allowing these people to spread wishful thinking and bronze age nonsense? You've been the destructive power of theocrats and those doing god's will. It causes dangerous thinking. I believe most religious people are upstanding citizens misguided by misguided parents. It's a vicious cycle. 

I'm really not sure what your analogy is about. It's as if you think faith is a valid argument that should not be challenged - that's called dogma and I despise it. It baffles me why you think this way. I haven't rested my case with "Don't be stupid" either. I've presented a logical argument for why I have this viewpoint that you seem to completely ignore (repeatedly, I might add).

Hope it's clear.



Not bad, I liked it. A very similiar comic could be made about big government/democracy/statism, the religion of the 21st century.