You're just repeating yourself and I gave you reasons why releasing the non-HDD console isn't a great idea. The fact is casual users aren't the only people buying the 12GB PS3.

I think the best way to go is keep the HDD in PS3, bundle every console with PS+ subscriptions, and get more people accustom to acquiring games digitally.

The 4GB 360 is a different. Xbox 360 games don't have huge mandatory installs and you can use USB memory sticks for more storage (you can use two 32GB sticks simultaneously for 64GB of extra storage). Games are also smaller in the 360 marketplace (no download is bigger than 8GB) so 64GB is a lot of space.

On the PS3 12GB, your only option for more space is buy a hard drive and that can easily be filled by large mandatory installs of a few games.

Is there really alot of games that require big mandatory installs? I thought there were only a few but I could be wrong. And with PS3 cant u use USB memory sticks as well? Or u could just buy a cheap 3rd party HDD. There are options for people who want to buy games digitally.

The reason im repeating myself is because u dont seem to get that the 12gb and 250-500gb are for different types of consumers. Do u think the people who get s 4gb 360 care about buying games digitally?

PS4 will not be 350 at launch and if it is then Sony will be losing just as much money as they did with the PS3 at launch.  You talk about teaming up with HDD maker but why not just do what the Wii U does and allows a 1-2 TB external hard drive to be hooked up via USB port?  I suppose that would be too convenient to the consumer for added storage space?  At least they don't try to rape your ass completely like Microsoft did with the 360 add on hard drives that barely added any GB worth of space for the price.

It appears most PS3 games have mandatory installs on the and are often a gig or several. A few mandatory installs and some patches can easily fill 12GB. So if they do make a non-HDD for more regions, I'd highly suggest boosting the storage.

People that aren't tech savvy don't want to install a hard drive and may not bother upgrading even if they have interest in the digital market.

People who buy a 4GB 360 probably have little or no knowledge of what's on the digital market place. But MS has very aggressive advertising and people often develop an interest in the market place. Fortunately on the 360, you can buy a cheap and simple to install USB memory stick for digital downloads.

I think we still have to wait to see what Gaikai will bring. I have a strong feeling that Sony will at the minimum be bringing out many PS3 titles as HD remakes for PS4. With so many people buying the competetion last gen, I think they will want to give people access to series like Uncharted, inFamous, God of War, and Killzone that may not have owned a PS3. It looks like both Sony and MS understand the importance of getting software to consumers, and the switch to x86 should make both consoles ramp up content at a very rappid rate. This will also many much simpler access to content in future consoles.

We will have to see what happens on PS4 pricing. I don't see the base unit being more than $400 maximum. At $400 they should be damn near break even with the hardware announced, and that is with a camera in every unit. I don't see how it could be anywhere close to $600 to manufacture and ship.

As far as the HDD situation goes, I don't have that much faith in consumers. If they did not have something that clearly had playstation on it, internal or USB, I think people would be to ignorant to figure it out. Plus, They could easily make 10 -15 bucks on it selling at $50, which IMO is good business a company struggling to make money. 

I never understood this 12gb model.

I mean everyone whines about the WiiU's 8gb model but the PS3's bluray drive is so slow that a 12gb model actually defeats the purpose for the console because you have to install all the games . When you buy for example GranTurismo5 the 12gb are almost full the WiiUs drive is fast enough so it does not require installing.


Or did they finally manage to install a better bluray drive so that installing is not mandatory anymore? IF that is the case ignore the rest of my reply.


@Zorg1000 thats because not a single 360 games requires an installation to be played. For just playing games even the old CORE or whatever 360 with the 265MB memory card is sufficient.

@bolded

Since when?

I was thinking costs were more close to 500 for PS4 but you have some analyst saying below 400 now. I'm thinking 450 still is probably more correct. We will have to wait and see on a teardown estimate after its release.

The only thing we know for sure is they won't be taking losses like they did with PS3 at launch.

You can but you need to buy brackets : http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-PlayStation-Replacement-Mounting-Bracket/dp/B009CV1OVC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1370784837&sr=8-1&keywords=ps3+bracket

They are not provided in the 12 GB console because the space for the hard drive is empty.