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Forums - Gaming Discussion - John Carmack, Frostbite 2 tech director, Crytek, and Gearbox endorse PS4 spec

vlad321 on 22 February 2013
zumnupy10 said:
vlad321 said:

I am not surprised. It's basically a mid range PC as it stands (maybe even a decent one, but definitely mid/low-mid by the time it comes out). I am even willing to bet that it has so much RAM in the first place is so it can run the OS and the other random crap in the background.... like a PC. Honestly, given the architecture, any reason why a game is on a PS4 and not a PC is publisher politics and nothing else.

Which explains Carmack, he knows how to do PC very well.

 

Edit: I just realized that making an emulator for this will be supr easy. Maybe just so much as a recompile and very few tweaks and done. This is super exciting.


Not really.  The original XBOX ran in X86 architecture and its emulators can barely run any game.


Actually, I believe that because no one actually cared to. I don't think anyne out there even bothered to suggest, much less attempt to do it and then fail.



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yo_john117 on 22 February 2013
Turkish said:

Wrong. The UE4 demo on PS4 looks way better than the one on pc: PC top, PS4  bottom

The funny thing is this was in all likelihood possible with just 4GB GDDR5 ram, PS4 will have double the amount. If OS takes 2GB away, the system will have 6GB for games.

PC will play catchup with PS4 until top of the line 2015-2016 gpus come out. There is simply nothing like it on pcs right now.

What!? How can you possibly say that?

The difference is HUGE.



F0X on 22 February 2013

If this is bad news for Microsoft, then I'm happy.



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kitler53 on 22 February 2013
ethomaz said:
Like I said before Sony create a machine for Developers and fullfill it with features for every kind of gamer.

Sony is playing the dominate the game industry by the book... no single minstake for now.

by and large i agree.  still, a little part of my is disappointed in a lack of surprises.  not that i really loved the wiimote, or kinect, or move, or balance board, or ps eye, or really anything (sometimes it sucks being so negative) i still reconize it's ability to invigorate sales which is important. 

the gaikai features are AMAZING!   ...but as of now i don't see it expanding the market just making the existing market very very happy.  even though i was all wtfbbqsauce at the time i was kind of hoping that "omni veiwer" rumor was true.



KBG29 on 22 February 2013
vlad321 said:

I am not surprised. It's basically a mid range PC as it stands (maybe even a decent one, but definitely mid/low-mid by the time it comes out). I am even willing to bet that it has so much RAM in the first place is so it can run the OS and the other random crap in the background.... like a PC. Honestly, given the architecture, any reason why a game is on a PS4 and not a PC is publisher politics and nothing else.

Which explains Carmack, he knows how to do PC very well.

 

Edit: I just realized that making an emulator for this will be supr easy. Maybe just so much as a recompile and very few tweaks and done. This is super exciting.

I think you are again seeing PS4 as a PC and not a closed system. Every generation we go through this, and every gen it's the same thing. Even thought these consoles indvidual parts are not as complex as the PCs best, the way they are integrated together make them much more powerful than they look. Remember that with the PS4 people will be coding directly to the chips, no directx or other API. The chips always have custom interfaces allowing direct access to eachother that is just not possible on PC. Being a set in stone spec devs know exactly what they are working with.

With that said here is what is great about this for the PC. Right now PS3/360 and low mid range laptop and desktop cards are the baseline. Devs have to make the games with those specs in mind because, that's were the userbase is. With PS4, and hopefully XB3 both having 8GB of memory, and similar to PC tech, they can start to make those the minimum spec. That means High end GPU's will start to see games that actually take advantage of them, and that means nvidia and amd wll start to push the limits more. I expect to see GPU's with 8GB GDDR5 in no time, and they will be followed by 10GB and 12GB in no time. 



Stop hate, let others live the life they were given. Everyone has their problems, and no one should have to feel ashamed for the way they were born. Be proud of who you are, encourage others to be proud of themselves. Learn, research, absorb everything around you. Nothing is meaningless, a purpose is placed on everything no matter how you perceive it. Discover how to love, and share that love with everything that you encounter. Help make existence a beautiful thing.

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thranx on 22 February 2013
KBG29 said:
vlad321 said:

I am not surprised. It's basically a mid range PC as it stands (maybe even a decent one, but definitely mid/low-mid by the time it comes out). I am even willing to bet that it has so much RAM in the first place is so it can run the OS and the other random crap in the background.... like a PC. Honestly, given the architecture, any reason why a game is on a PS4 and not a PC is publisher politics and nothing else.

Which explains Carmack, he knows how to do PC very well.

 

Edit: I just realized that making an emulator for this will be supr easy. Maybe just so much as a recompile and very few tweaks and done. This is super exciting.

I think you are again seeing PS4 as a PC and not a closed system. Every generation we go through this, and every gen it's the same thing. Even thought these consoles indvidual parts are not as complex as the PCs best, the way they are integrated together make them much more powerful than they look. Remember that with the PS4 people will be coding directly to the chips, no directx or other API. The chips always have custom interfaces allowing direct access to eachother that is just not possible on PC. Being a set in stone spec devs know exactly what they are working with.

With that said here is what is great about this for the PC. Right now PS3/360 and low mid range laptop and desktop cards are the baseline. Devs have to make the games with those specs in mind because, that's were the userbase is. With PS4, and hopefully XB3 both having 8GB of memory, and similar to PC tech, they can start to make those the minimum spec. That means High end GPU's will start to see games that actually take advantage of them, and that means nvidia and amd wll start to push the limits more. I expect to see GPU's with 8GB GDDR5 in no time, and they will be followed by 10GB and 12GB in no time. 

I dont think that is possible. I am not a programmer so i can be wrong. but i think that statement is completley wrong and not even possible.



KBG29 on 22 February 2013
thranx said:
KBG29 said:
vlad321 said:

I think you are again seeing PS4 as a PC and not a closed system. Every generation we go through this, and every gen it's the same thing. Even thought these consoles indvidual parts are not as complex as the PCs best, the way they are integrated together make them much more powerful than they look. Remember that with the PS4 people will be coding directly to the chips, no directx or other API. The chips always have custom interfaces allowing direct access to eachother that is just not possible on PC. Being a set in stone spec devs know exactly what they are working with.

I dont think that is possible. I am not a programmer so i can be wrong. but i think that statement is completley wrong and not even possible.

http://gamingbolt.com/developers-will-be-able-to-code-to-the-metal-on-ps4-yoshida
http://playstation-techzone.com/2013/01/ps4-and-xbox-720-performance-potential-discussed-by-nvidia-dev-photos

Basically as I understand it, the devs should be able to write their own API diretcly to the metal, giving them full control of the hardware. So yes their is an API, but only because the devs created it, again if I understand this correctly.



Stop hate, let others live the life they were given. Everyone has their problems, and no one should have to feel ashamed for the way they were born. Be proud of who you are, encourage others to be proud of themselves. Learn, research, absorb everything around you. Nothing is meaningless, a purpose is placed on everything no matter how you perceive it. Discover how to love, and share that love with everything that you encounter. Help make existence a beautiful thing.

Kevyn B Grams
10/03/2010 

KBG29 on PSN&XBL

Landsharkk on 22 February 2013

The approval from dev's is totally expected. I mean which dev would be upset about the PS4 adopting x86 architecture over the old cell stuff?

Sony: "Ps4 will have x86 architecture and will be developer friendly!"

Microsoft: "Hi, have you heard of the Xbox 360? The console that's been around for 7 years and is baesd on the x86 architecture?"

Also, this: http://www.ign.com/articles/2005/05/20/e3-2005-microsofts-xbox-360-vs-sonys-playstation-3

I own game devices from many platforms, but in my opinion Sony with the PS4 is just playing catch-up. Microsoft is extremely capable of stomping all over the PS4 specs with their next Xbox. Although that doesn't really matter in the end, mostly it's developer friendly that they need and Microsoft has had that for the past 7 years. Again, Sony is just playing catch-up.



Turkish on 22 February 2013
Landsharkk said:
The approval from dev's is totally expected. I mean which dev would be upset about the PS4 adopting x86 architecture over the old cell stuff?

Sony: "Ps4 will have x86 architecture and will be developer friendly!"

Microsoft: "Hi, have you heard of the Xbox 360? The console that's been around for 7 years and is baesd on the x86 architecture?"

Also, this: http://www.ign.com/articles/2005/05/20/e3-2005-microsofts-xbox-360-vs-sonys-playstation-3

I own game devices from many platforms, but in my opinion Sony with the PS4 is just playing catch-up. Microsoft is extremely capable of stomping all over the PS4 specs with their next Xbox. Although that doesn't really matter in the end, mostly it's developer friendly that they need and Microsoft has had that for the past 7 years. Again, Sony is just playing catch-up.

The sources that were right about PS4s rumours also say the Nextbox doesn't support used games, is always online and requires Kinect, has 8GB DDR3 ram and is 1,2 TFLOPs.

The only advantage MS had was its ease of use for devs and it loses that advantage with PS4. Microsoft will have a hard time now that the PS4 offers the same developer friendly environment. Devs like Jonathan Blow was not even approached by Microsoft and he's making The Witness (timed) exclusive entirely out of goodwill to Sony with no money involved

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=515050



Landsharkk on 22 February 2013
Turkish said:
Landsharkk said:
The approval from dev's is totally expected. I mean which dev would be upset about the PS4 adopting x86 architecture over the old cell stuff?

Sony: "Ps4 will have x86 architecture and will be developer friendly!"

Microsoft: "Hi, have you heard of the Xbox 360? The console that's been around for 7 years and is baesd on the x86 architecture?"

Also, this: http://www.ign.com/articles/2005/05/20/e3-2005-microsofts-xbox-360-vs-sonys-playstation-3

I own game devices from many platforms, but in my opinion Sony with the PS4 is just playing catch-up. Microsoft is extremely capable of stomping all over the PS4 specs with their next Xbox. Although that doesn't really matter in the end, mostly it's developer friendly that they need and Microsoft has had that for the past 7 years. Again, Sony is just playing catch-up.

The sources that were right about PS4s rumours also say the Nextbox doesn't support used games, is always online and requires Kinect, has 8GB DDR3 ram and is 1,2 TFLOPs.

The only advantage MS had was its ease of use for devs and it loses that advantage with PS4. Microsoft will have a hard time now that the PS4 offers the same developer friendly environment. Devs like Jonathan Blow was not even approached by Microsoft and he's making The Witness (timed) exclusive entirely out of goodwill to Sony with no money involved

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=515050


Let's be fair here.  Rumors said that BOTH next gen consoles wouldn't support used games.  Aside from that, nobody would be that stupid to block used games.  I still don't understand why that rumor even exists.  It always pops up a few months before the next gen of consoles and is always squashed when the reveal happens.  

One other bit of interseting information, of the top 20 games available on both PS3 and Xbox 360, the Xbox 360 versions outsell the PS3 versions almost every single time.  That isn't due to developers not liking one or the other, that's players/customers choosing Xbox 360 over the PS3.  

While Sony switching to x86 is good for them, it's not going to be enough to crush MS, nor put pressure on them.