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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Why PS4 won't be cutting edge, and neither will Xbox3 - or Why Nintendo might win next gen

 

Is my reasoning sound?

Hellz yeah! Spot on 265 33.42%
 
I never thought of it like that.... 69 8.70%
 
So it's the mental institution next for you? 101 12.74%
 
So very, very wrong 266 33.54%
 
I'm a pussy with no opinion 88 11.10%
 
Total:789

People forget that the WiiU has to power the Gamepad ASWELL as the TV. I'm assuming if Sony/MS take a different approach to the Gamepad , they will only have to focus on the TV visuals and thus even if The consoles were SLIGHTLY weaker than WiiU, there games could look better.



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All I care about is dat 399 PS4.



4 ≈ One

We never now...
But one thing I'm quite sure is, right now M$ and Sony still spinning their head and pressing the cost production for their next gen.

And cost production is not the only M$ and Sony concern, right now they need to convicing 3rd party to support their next machine.
After that 3rd party need to learn their dev kit.... Remember how developer had a really hard time to port a game to PS3 and yet still can't beat 360 graphic if we talk about multiplatform games.

There is a lot complicated things for next gen race. But as a gamer (not fanboy) I really hope I still can see a glorious time like when Sony did with their PS2.



DanneSandin said:
freebs2 said:

DanneSandin said:

 If Sony won't make a cutting edge machine, why would Microsoft? 

The would because if they can make a tecnical superior console at the same or similar price, they'll have the chance to kick their most direct competitor right in the balls. Also I'm not sure Kinect is really so much expansive to manifacture.

The rumor has it that xbox3 will come bundled with Kinect 2.0, so that's gotta be more expansive than the version we got today. As I stated in the OP, I believe 3rd party developers would make games for WiiStation (if they're similar in power) and therefore not utilizing Xbox3's ful capacity.

You could be right but it depends on how much the newest game engines and tools are scalable. Also why should Ps4 and WiiU be similar in power? WiiU it's not a big genertion jump for Ps3 and 360 owners, in terms of graphics at least. I understand Sony can't probably afford to sell on loss anymore but the ps4 needs to be significantly more powerfull than WiiU otherwise, ps3 owners won't see a generation gap to justify the console upgrade.

Imo a possible sceario is Ps4 launching between 399$ and 499$ by the end of 2013 (by that time the WiiU could likely be sold at profit for 249$ and 299$). Supposing the ps4 won't have a tablet-pad but a reagular controller, this should be enough to make the console more powerfull than WiiU by a significant margin and still selling on profit. I think the paragon between Ps4 and WiiU is fair enough since both will have to face the same exchange rates porblem.

Also you're making an assumption when you implicitly say, developers will want to create an equivalent port of their games on every possible platform. This has happened this gen because market shares were more or less equally split. But you can't know if same thing is going to happen next-gen. During Ps2/GC/Xbox days, the ps2 got the most of 3rd party exclusives, and that's obviously not because the games couldn't be ported on GC and Xbox but simply because the Ps2 was a dominant console. Now let's say, to make another assumption, microsoft will go aggressive next-gen and will launch a cutting-edge xbox3 for a similar price to the (not cutting edge but tecnically superior to WiiU) Ps4. In this case the Xbox3 could have tha chance to gather both ex-360 users and ex-ps3 users and become a new dominant console, hence it could give 3rd parties a reason to fully utilize xbox3 capacity.

 



In time we will see but people should remember that ps3's excessive cost was in part due to Blu-ray and the cell processor. Next gen there will not be any new media platforms and Sony won't make the mistake of making a processor so different from everything else on the market, the Vita is evidence of this.

But possibly the most important thing is the fact that the PS4 isn't launching till at least 2014 (more or less confirmed by gamestop). So we don't necessarily know what will and won't be affordable by the time of its launch.

In terms of profit Nintendo will always be on top though



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Mummelmann said:
Anari said:


The 360 also launched first, this matters very little,

 especially if you have poor support and only 1st party and late, late ports to live off of. And just how are they set to dominate Japan? If anything, Nintendo are losing their grip on Japan, especially in the home console market, the Wii has shown appaling numbers there lately and the home console market as a whole is fast becoming irrelevant in Japan compared to the global scale. There is no reason to think that the WiiU will dominate in Japan, there's no reason to think that any of the consoles will do very well there at all next generation. Handhelds will sell well, at least for now.

As for price and features; one has to consider that it will likely be compared to the PS3 and 360, so the price is far from amazing and the same goes for features, there's nothing incredible or mindblowing about, its more catching up to the norm.

 


 Oh please, launching first this gen greatly benefitted MS. They've gained alot of ground this gen coming from off the Xbox. Anybody who says launching before Sony wasn't a great idea by MS is talking pure BS.

And your reasoning for Nintendo losing it's grip on Japan in the console market is...their 6/7 year old console slowing down in sales?

Reasons to think WiiU will dominate in Japan:

- WiiU is launching with a Monster Hunter bundle

Every Japanese Premium Set includes Dragon Quest X Wii U Beta Access!

- Launching at a good price.

Sounds familiar? Yeah, just like with 3DS, Nintendo are taking steps to secure Japan . Those are two big franchises in Japan available in  at launch exclusively to WiiU, and they're probably not done yet.

And yeah, it's funny to see you say WiiU, a system launching with a bunch of 3rd party exclusives and multiplats, has "poor support and only 1st party and late, late ports to live off of." It's like you don't even know anything about what the console offers.

 

What new console isn't compared to old consoles when it launches? The WiiU is something new,  launching at very reasonable  prices with a solid line up. Consumers are going to snap it up this holiday and beyond regardless of PS360, two saturated consoles in a generation that's dragged on too long.

As for the features "catching up to the norm", can you point me to the social gaming network available on PS3/360? Because last time I checked, they don't have such a thing.

Does Sony and MS yet have a system where all retail games can also be made available for digital download day one? No.

WiiU also offers impressive multi-tasking capabilities with the ability to surf the internet, interact on Miiverse, chat to friends while playing a game.

As for Nintendo TVii, it offers alot of things that are not available on PSN or XBL.

Sure, it integrates streaming-video services like Netflix, Amazon Instant, Hulu Plus, and YouTube into the Wii U, but TVii is a far more ambitious platform, capable of cross-platform search through both streaming-video services and live TV listings, providing complementary second-screen information and social interaction on the GamePad screen, and controlling your DVR and other home theater components together like a universal remote. That's a step further than even the Xbox 360's impressive TV efforts.

It's more comparable with what Google TV was supposed to be but failed at, except more simple, accessible and streamlined. It has great potential and If  it really is like Nintendo showed it to be at their conference, will be an attrative aspect of the console for many people.

So yeah, what Nintendo has shown so far is anything but 'catching up to the norm of current gen'. It offers much more than that.



freebs2 said:
DanneSandin said:
freebs2 said:

DanneSandin said:

 If Sony won't make a cutting edge machine, why would Microsoft? 

The would because if they can make a tecnical superior console at the same or similar price, they'll have the chance to kick their most direct competitor right in the balls. Also I'm not sure Kinect is really so much expansive to manifacture.

The rumor has it that xbox3 will come bundled with Kinect 2.0, so that's gotta be more expansive than the version we got today. As I stated in the OP, I believe 3rd party developers would make games for WiiStation (if they're similar in power) and therefore not utilizing Xbox3's ful capacity.

You could be right but it depends on how much the newest game engines and tools are scalable. Also why should Ps4 and WiiU be similar in power? WiiU it's not a big genertion jump for Ps3 and 360 owners, in terms of graphics at least. I understand Sony can't probably afford to sell on loss anymore but the ps4 needs to be significantly more powerfull than WiiU otherwise, ps3 owners won't see a generation gap to justify the console upgrade.

Imo a possible sceario is Ps4 launching between 399$ and 499$ by the end of 2013 (by that time the WiiU could likely be sold at profit for 249$ and 299$). Supposing the ps4 won't have a tablet-pad but a reagular controller, this should be enough to make the console more powerfull than WiiU by a significant margin and still selling on profit. I think the paragon between Ps4 and WiiU is fair enough since both will have to face the same exchange rates porblem.

Also you're making an assumption when you implicitly say, developers will want to create an equivalent port of their games on every possible platform. This has happened this gen because market shares were more or less equally split. But you can't know if same thing is going to happen next-gen. During Ps2/GC/Xbox days, the ps2 got the most of 3rd party exclusives, and that's obviously not because the games couldn't be ported on GC and Xbox but simply because the Ps2 was a dominant console. Now let's say, to make another assumption, microsoft will go aggressive next-gen and will launch a cutting-edge xbox3 for a similar price to the (not cutting edge but tecnically superior to WiiU) Ps4. In this case the Xbox3 could have tha chance to gather both ex-360 users and ex-ps3 users and become a new dominant console, hence it could give 3rd parties a reason to fully utilize xbox3 capacity.

 

Unless the world economy really turns around in 2013, no console will sell in any significant numbers at $499.  Even $399 dollars is pushing it.



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I'd like to think neither Sony nor MS would dump the amount of power (And money) into their system they did this gen, especially Sony which isn't exactly healthy across its entire portfolio of products. I'd also like to think 3rd party support will be strong for WiiU, especially after the other systems launch. Yes, I'd to think all that ... but history. It has a tendency to repeat itself.

What tricks do MS and Sony have? Raw power. Sony can't get away with launching a new system second or third in line and have it be seen as weak. Look at PSP, and its sales. Did Sony learn its lesson with Vita? Nope, they produced an expensive item with top of the line graphical ability. They will do the same with PS4 I'm afraid. Nintendo may be the only company who can get away with a weaker system. Microsoft did learn some lessons from XBox to 360, cutting some corners, cutting costs. They also have a hit on their hands, with their own motion sensor which will no doubt be bundled in every new system. So maybe they can do it again, and we may see a console not very much stronger than the Wii?

As for Nintendo, Iwata thinks the gap between Nintendo's console and the other two will be less than it was with the Wii and the current consoles. I think he's right, but a gap there will still be. And if it's significant enough to make it impossible to port games down to WiiU, we will see yet another 3rd party drought on a Nintendo system. WiiU's saving grace, would be the controller. Which is rather 'standard' in terms of dual analog and traditional buttons. Companies won't have to fight a two front war like they did with the Wii, being graphically weaker and having a very different controller.



Cthulhu said:
There is no need for Sony to release a new console if ps3 can compete with a "next" gen console

I never expected that when I paid 650euro for a 2007 60gb ps3


Honestly... if it cant run skyrim properly, then you know you have an aging console. No trolling just my oppinion. 



Yay!!!

The graphics of the PS4 and XboxNext won't be wildly better than the wiiU. What we will see is, higher frame rates, better anti-aliasing, smoother edges, less distortion on texture maps, less screen tearing, and better quality lighting and shadows. But to the average gamer, that is not going to translate to "Wow, that's WAY BETTER than anything I've seen before."

But if you think for a second, that Sony and Microsoft are going to come out for another generation of consoles, and not throw everything they have at it...you'd be sadly mistaken. Both have seen what Nintendo was able to accomplish with non-traditional controls. The tested the water with the Kinect, and the Move. Whatever they have up their sleeve, will be better versions of what they've tried already.

You are right about one thing though. Now that Nintendo has 3rd party support, all platforms will have all games on them, EXCEPT for 1st party titles. While it is true that this is where Nintendo shines, Sony has done an excellent job of creating a stellar 1st party lineup of their own. I'd say it's right up there with Nintendo now. Seeing as Nintendo isn't creating very many new IP, they are just re imagining the existing IP they have had for decades. While Sony on the other hand, are still bringing out new IP such as Beyond and Last of Us, to name two of the most recent.



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