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Forums - Sales Discussion - Post-NPD adjustments

mhsillen on 13 January 2012

I didn't think this site was  was married. to ndp. They should stand on there own.



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Reasonable on 13 January 2012

Let's stop all the attempts to dig up channel stuffing comments shall we? It's just counter productive and will get people banned eventually. Almost always it was only hardcore fanboys (if I can use that term for a moment) and no-one really interested in the numbers no matter what they prefer.

Channel stuffing can (and does) happen but it requires agreement of retailers with suppliers and TBH I've only rarely seen examples in last few years (working in retail). Normally it's based on agreements/deals and is rarely above a more regional occurrence. As others have noted as a retailer you'd be pretty stupid to allow another company to order you to buy more than you want.

If there has been any agreed stuffing it will show up in shipments soon enough as it cannot continue unabated.

Most likely, if there are an excess of 360s in stock, retailers simply over-ordered either to take advantage of deal terms offered by MS or because based on November sales they expected much higher 360 sales or a combination of the two.

Again, if this has occurred we'll see it in future shipment quantities.

The site always corrects with all data including shipments as they release so a picture of the truth will emerge eventually.



Try to be reasonable... its easier than you think...

Kasz216 on 13 January 2012
kowenicki said:
Turkish said:
Argh_College said:
shanbcn said:
360 still overtracked quite badly.

yeah yeah right Lol You think that theres >2 Milion on shelves, over on U.S maybe since i dont know what adjustments were made but Way undertracked in others.

Undertracked? Where? Europe? Japan? The 2 strongest markets of the competitor? Its becoming more and more clear MS shipped too many, they overestimated the demand. This time we also didnt hear anything from that xbox dude(something with major) who always bragged about NPD numbers.

its aaron greenberg that announces 360 numbers and yes we did hear from him actually.  The NPD numbers for the 360 are very impressive when compared to the competition.... basically obliterating the competition again... they only look poor when we have all been looking at VGC numbers for the last 4 weeks.  

...and you cant ship too many.... they arent sent unsolicited to retailers you know.

Retailers MAY order too many and end up returning them if they are allowed, but it isnt channel stuffing.  Channel stuffing doesnt really exist.


No channel stuffing is actually a real thing.  It's a buisness term and everything.

Buisnesses tend to Channel stuff in a few ways.

1) Artificially lowering their prices.  IE I want to channel stuff at X-mas right before the new year to look good on the reports and have a good bragging number.  So I offer a discount on each unit, or even better, on orders larger then a certain amount.

2) I suggest that I am prioritizing shipping towards those buying more consoles, vs a first in, first out system.

3) I tie something else to purchase of the product.   (IE: We won't sell you 200 Xboxes unless you buy 30 zunes.)

 

 They artificially increase retail orders by offering deals meant to convince them to hold on to extra product and/or return it just to get a big number out the door.

In general, channel stuffing is detectable, but usually you have to wait until the next shipment reports to see.



sergiodaly on 13 January 2012
kowenicki said:
sergiodaly said:
psrock said:
kowenicki said:
psrock said:
kowenicki said:
Turkish said:
Argh_College said:
shanbcn said:
360 still overtracked quite badly.

 

 

 

 

hmmm

n...

psrock 13 hours ago
It seems the horse was too high. 

MS stuffed the channels, mostly because retailers ordered based on Black FRiday numbers. Can;t blame them, I never expected anything less than 2.5 million. And every console is down.

 

I never said stuffing the channel doesn't exist. We just saw MS doing it. 

 

Alright, this is from your own tread.

psrock said:

I'm surprise how close the PS3 and 360 are the last 6 months, I expected a bigger gap due kinect. 

 


channel stuffing will answer that one

 

 http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=129135&page=1

 


i have nothing to do with this... but was reading your argument...

and i have to say

BUSTED!


click on the link.... and see whre it is obvious to even the most stupid I am taking the piss...  the massive clue being a small yellow face winking.

so no... not busted.

this forum is shit sometimes.

uoohhhh... take a chill pill dude.

it was suposed to be funny and all... maybe a yellow face at the end would help you understand. didn't think you need that... my mistake. next time i'll deliver...

don't take things so personaly... just a friendly advice...

Proudest Platinums - BF: Bad Company, Killzone 2 , Battlefield 3 and GTA4

Kasz216 on 13 January 2012
kowenicki said:
Kasz216 said:
kowenicki said:
Turkish said:
Argh_College said:
shanbcn said:
360 still overtracked quite badly.

yeah yeah right Lol You think that theres >2 Milion on shelves, over on U.S maybe since i dont know what adjustments were made but Way undertracked in others.

Undertracked? Where? Europe? Japan? The 2 strongest markets of the competitor? Its becoming more and more clear MS shipped too many, they overestimated the demand. This time we also didnt hear anything from that xbox dude(something with major) who always bragged about NPD numbers.

its aaron greenberg that announces 360 numbers and yes we did hear from him actually.  The NPD numbers for the 360 are very impressive when compared to the competition.... basically obliterating the competition again... they only look poor when we have all been looking at VGC numbers for the last 4 weeks.  

...and you cant ship too many.... they arent sent unsolicited to retailers you know.

Retailers MAY order too many and end up returning them if they are allowed, but it isnt channel stuffing.  Channel stuffing doesnt really exist.


No channel stuffing is actually a real thing.  It's a buisness term and everything.

Buisnesses tend to Channel stuff in a few ways.

1) Artificially lowering their prices.  IE I want to channel stuff at X-mas right before the new year to look good on the reports and have a good bragging number.  So I offer a discount on each unit, or even better, on orders larger then a certain amount.

2) I suggest that I am prioritizing shipping towards those buying more consoles, vs a first in, first out system.

3) I tie something else to purchase of the product.   (IE: We won't sell you 200 Xboxes unless you buy 30 zunes.)

 

 They artificially increase retail orders by offering deals meant to convince them to hold on to extra product and/or return it just to get a big number out the door.

In general, channel stuffing is detectable, but usually you have to wait until the next shipment reports to see.

I understand thast... but thats not what people here understand channel stuiffing to be... they would have you believe that manufacturer x sends shit loads of unwanted inventory with no agreement in place to a completely unaware retailer... its idiotic in the extreme.

Oh no, that doesn't happen... anymore anyway.

You could argue Sony used to do a variation of that... back when their definition of "Sold" was "Sitting in our warehouses waiting to be shipped" versus the more conventional "Shipped = Sold".



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shanbcn on 13 January 2012

Sony said they sold 3.9m world wide this fall, in 2009 they annonced 3.8m sold when PS3 slim came out. Can anyone compare last weeks of 2009 to 2011 with VGZ numbers?



leatherhat on 13 January 2012

Everythings overtracked, everythings undertracked. I thought you guys would have learned this by now?



ǝןdɯıs ʇı dǝǝʞ oʇ ǝʞıן ı ʍouʞ noʎ 

Ask me about being an elitist jerk

Time for hype

Mummelmann on 13 January 2012

I'm confused. Who is the king of channel stuffing now? MS or Sony? I hope its still Sony, at least they will have come out on top of something this gen...



non-gravity on 13 January 2012
Xenostar said:

Sad times for VGC, if its off by 2m which it clearly is if 66m is definatley sold, then why should we trust that the Wii and PS3 numbers are close to being right either, for all we know they could all be off by 2m+

Think from now on ill just stick to quaterly shipment statments, its the only thing thats accurate. 

The 66m is the quarterly shipment number or close to it....



brendude13 on 13 January 2012
Mummelmann said:
I'm confused. Who is the king of channel stuffing now? MS or Sony? I hope its still Sony, at least they will have come out on top of something this gen...

Must...resist...very poor...mum joke.