Alright, see you guys later.

Honestly Wada needs to shut the hell up and get his company to give us some damned games. Square Enix bought Game Arts and Quest. Since that point we have gotten no Ogre Battle, Tactics Ogre, Grandia or "real" Lunar titles. Give us some games Wada and stop complaining about your games not selling as well because YOU choose to bet on the wrong console in the Japanese market.

BTW Sorry about my gruffness but Wada does this every other week. SE needs to give some quality titles or sell their IPs to a company that will actually make use of them. I am tired of them whoring out Final Fantasy while ignoring other quality franchises they own.

swyggi said: 2) Nobody called you a fanboy so you can put the victim card away, there's enough people playing that on a daily basis. Your argument is suspicious regardless of your 'loyalties' because you changed it when faced with evidence. Also, if the PS3 fan can use "wait until X game comes out" then Wii fans can do it too with gauranteed million seller exclusives like The Crystal Bearers coming this year. Not directly no one did. It's just odd that the PS3 was brought into this. When did I change my argument? My argument is around "There aren't that many good selling 3rd party exclusive titles for the Wii". I used the "wait until X games comes out" for the PS3 because from looking at the future line-up it looks that way and I wish the Wii had it that way. You're right for saying that Wii gamers can say that too, it's just that most of the future 3rd party exclusives for the Wii don't look appealing to me. I guess it just depends on your point of view.

No, that wasn't the discussion. You changed the discussion to something that (as has already been pointed out) was largely irrelevant. As far as comparing it to the PS3 (and 360) goes, it's very important. A developer makes games based on their options. If the Wii is a more financially viable option than the PS3, then that will of course affect the developer's decisions. As far as there not being many 3rd party exclusives that do well on the Wii goes, there aren't many 3rd party exclusives on the Wii at all... Most of the good (or at least advertised) ones that are on the Wii have been successful.

Again, it's very important that the PS3's 3rd party million seller list is less than half the Wii's. Considering the very large difference in development costs and sales between the platforms this will absolutely affect game development in the future.  I also love the irony of you complaining about people adding the PS3 to the sales discussion right after you added exclusives to the sales discussion.  Hypocrisy works to your disadvantage.

swyggi said: from bdbdbd @Dodece: Redsteel was a lot like Assassins Creed, big budget for the platform, lots of hype but it didn't live up to hype and the game had some serious flaws. You're right about that RS had a lot of sales because of being launch title and the lack of competition, but consider the low installbase at the time it was released. RS would propably have pretty similar sales if it would have been released 6 months later. So when the game is qualitywise so similar with Assassins Creed, i wouldn't say Wii owners having high tolerance for bad quality games in comparision. Besides, haven't the problem in bad 3rd party game sales been in their low quality. AC didn't live up to the hype, but it's quality was much greater than Red Steel. I usually don't trust review scores, but there is a fine line between telling if a game is superior to another game in terms of just the score. Red Steel http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/932528.asp?q=Red%20Steel Assassins Creed http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/930022.asp?q=Assassins%20Creed From reading hundreds of comments online, I can also tell you that people enjoyed AC much more than Red Steel. I rarely even hear about anyone liking RS honestly.

As we all know, Ubisoft blackmailed review sites about AC reviews, so Assassins Creeds number is propably inflated by that. And another thing we know, is the "Wii opposition" among the reviewers, which pushes the RS number down. When RS came out, a lot of people liked it, just like they like AC at the moment, so we should wait a year and see how its appeal lasts. Now, i'm not saying that AC wouldn't be better than Redsteel, but let's face it: they're both crap. I do agree with you, that the exclusives define the console, and usually make the reason to buy the specific platform, but if a question is, that will 3rd parties sell on console X, it's irrelevant whether they are exclusives or multiplatform titles. And as we all know, different types of games sell different on different console due the demographic.

I wonder what AC's review would have been like if it had Redsteel graphics?

from naztip
I also love the irony of you complaining about people adding the PS3 to the sales discussion right after you added exclusives to the sales discussion. Hypocrisy works to your disadvantage.


If there's any irony, it's what you just said "Hypocrisy works to your disadvantage" and proves my point even further from a subconscious perspective. You just admitted what you think of me. You forget, I'm not the one that brought the PS3 into the discussion. (a little off current discussion) Our (me and you) first argument was about Crisis Core's soon-to-be success where you even admitted that you hated the original FFVII IIRC. (back on current discussion) We(me and other posters) were specifically talking about the Wii's 3rd party games and line-up. Someone else brings up the PS3 shortly after, I ask what the PS3 has to do with this, a few of the posters (including yourself now) start concentrating on subtleties in the argument that would hopefully provoke me to use flames and let you get the upper hand in the argument. I obviously have no choice but to argue the subtleties from this point until you let it go. On second thought, there's no point "you'll never let go of the darkness".

from bdbdbd
As we all know, Ubisoft blackmailed review sites about AC reviews, so Assassins Creeds number is propably inflated by that. And another thing we know, is the "Wii opposition" among the reviewers, which pushes the RS number down. When RS came out, a lot of people liked it, just like they like AC at the moment, so we should wait a year and see how its appeal lasts. Now, i'm not saying that AC wouldn't be better than Redsteel, but let's face it: they're both crap.

I do agree with you, that the exclusives define the console, and usually make the reason to buy the specific platform, but if a question is, that will 3rd parties sell on console X, it's irrelevant whether they are exclusives or multiplatform titles. And as we all know, different types of games sell different on different console due the demographic.

The "Wii opposition" among the reviewers is kind of a relative issue. There are many low reviews given to awesome games and vice-versa (high reviews given to mediocre and overrated games) on every platform.

To your second paragraph:Looking at the exclusives vs. first party vs. second party vs. 3rd party vs. multiplatform issue, the only safe way to argue is that it's all subjective. It seems like change happens more often in VG's now.

Ajax said: everything became clear when he said this: [quote]My issue with Crisis Core was with the combat system, which was stiff and relied too much on luck. The plot I don't care about anyway, as I really disliked FFVII.[q/uote] is it strange that you don't like Crisis Core when you ''really dislike FFVII'' ?

No, but why would it be strange?

 However, I do find it strange that you would think that disliking the story of a turn based RPG can influence one's opinion of the gameplay of an action RPG.

 

No, but why would it be strange?

However, I do find it strange that you would think that disliking the story of a turn based RPG can influence one's opinion of the gameplay of an action RPG.


I think he meant more in terms of the experience of the game. The story of an RPG, if done right can make the gameplay feel better. Sort of like rest periods after tough action-packed battles. I'm not saying that Turn-based RPG's are tough (you can modify the battles with FF7 to make them harder) it's just that some rpg battle systems can over excite you with just eye candy alone, and then when the "rest periods" come up you feel like relaxing and reflecting on the characters in the RPG while you watch their story unfold. Afterwards it's then time to go back to battles, plus you're all rested up and even more into the gameplay than before.

I apologize if that doesn't make much sense, but it's really hard to explain. It's sort of a psychological effect.