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Forums - Gaming Discussion - New Xbox getting Blu-ray?

NotStan said:
Modnation racers, god those were some of the longest loading times I've ever encountered.

Not bothered in the slightest, I don't think MS will be either, they see it as an investment, and really to a company that big even the approximately calculated value of 111m is nothing, seeing as they probably made more profit this Q alone.

Contrary to popular belief, I am finding it hard to believe that MS and Sony hate each other anywhere as much as the majority of keyboard warriors on the interwebz.

Those were God awfully long, lol.  I thought they were fixed in a patch, but I guess a few long ones remained.  Of course, that game is an exception.  For the vast majority of PS3 games, even ones that are more graphically demanding than MNR, the load times aren't very long at all.  Probably between 5-10 secs.



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thismeintiel said:
NotStan said:
Modnation racers, god those were some of the longest loading times I've ever encountered.

Not bothered in the slightest, I don't think MS will be either, they see it as an investment, and really to a company that big even the approximately calculated value of 111m is nothing, seeing as they probably made more profit this Q alone.

Contrary to popular belief, I am finding it hard to believe that MS and Sony hate each other anywhere as much as the majority of keyboard warriors on the interwebz.

Those were God awfully long, lol.  I thought they were fixed in a patch, but I guess a few long ones remained.  Of course, that game is an exception.  For the vast majority of PS3 games, even ones that are more graphically demanding than MNR, the load times aren't very long at all.  Probably between 5-10 secs.

Nah they really weren't, me and a friend sat through about 1.5 hours of patches and updates only to come up against 30+ seconds loading times ;_;



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.

It isn't very likely. Microsoft does not want to send a dime to Sony or help them increase market share in any way. Nintendo rarely supported formats that another company used. During cartridge years they always made their karts unique offering features the other formats did not. When CD and DVD came along Nintendo resisted they made N64 carts and mini-disks. Even the DVD format they used on Wii was unique.

Microsoft will likely release its own disk format similar to BluRay. Some would argue MS needs BluRay so consumers can play movies on it. However with NetFlix and all the video streaming capabilities, BluRay isn't necessary consumers can still watch their favorite movies and Microsoft doesn't need to support Sony in any way.

I would seriously be surprised if BluRay showed up in Nex-Box.

Also a word to the wise, most Gamestop/EBGames employees are idiots. Most don't even know basic information about upcoming products let alone products that haven't been announced. They get all the same info we do and chances are they aren't as devout as we are. I have only met one or two employees at EBGames who were actually competent about the industry as a whole. Some are Sony fanboys, Nintendo fanboys or MS fanboys and others just aren't actual gamers.

You'd be smart to avoid ever referencing an EBGames employee as if you take what they say seriously. The majority don't know squat in general!



-JC7

"In God We Trust - In Games We Play " - Joel Reimer

 

Jay520 said:
LivingMetal said:
MasterVG71782 said:
LivingMetal said:
MasterVG71782 said:
LivingMetal said:
selnor said:
PlaystaionGamer said:
i would laugh hard at how many xbox fans will be like 'blu ray is the best! look my xbox has bluray' after all the shade they threw at sony.. it would be interesting..


It wouldnt bother me. If they use it for games so be it. I still wont be buying bLU Ray films. I have 1080p films on Xbox Live. Al of them which are impossible to scratch or break. Wy would I go backwards in my technology just because its there.


Personally, I prefer the 5.1 and 7.1 uncompressed audio and the extras you'd find on an optical disc.  So having more content and higher quality audio going backwards in technology?  You must be humoring yourself.

Aren't Bluray discs supposed to be pretty hard to scratch, unlike CDs and DVDs...

 

They aren't impossible to damage, but they are far more scratch resistant than CDs and DVDS.

I haven't heard of many reports anywhere saying people have had their Blurays scratched all to hell and back, like with CDs and DVDs :P

Of course, I take extra special care of my discs, so maybe I'm just the exception.


And I still have plenty of CDs and DVDs, and they all work fine.  Doesn't the Xbox 360 employs DVDs as a game storage medium?  So wouldn't settling for the Xbox 360 over the PS3 would be going backwards in technology according to Seece's logic?



You mean Selnor, yes?


Yes, mistaken identity.  Seece, please forgive me for the confusion.  



thismeintiel said:
disolitude said:

There is a little too much Sony coolade in your posts my friend...You're the type of dude that defended UMD's cause Sony invented them despite hte fact they were gimping the PSP.

I hope we both get our way next gen. Then you can enjoy your load times and have bluray and I can pay a little more to get games on memory cartriges and have an SSD hard drive in my console of choice...

Seems there is way more anti-Sony Kool-aid (I prefer the name brand) in your posts.  It's funny you speak of load times as if they are god awful this gen and stop people from playing for a greater amount of time.  You must be very impatient if that's how see things.  Then again, if you added up all the load times from playing straight from the disc vs. the time it takes to install the game on a HDD+plus the load times (yea, things still have load times even if installed on the HDD), it probably would take the same amount of time, if not longer, to get through the HDD game.  Either way, load times will be greatly reduced next gen with the advancement of the Blu-ray tech/speed.  But, you just keep drinking your Kool-aid, and I'll continue to enjoy mine.

Edit:  Also forgot to mention that the largest capacity SD cards are 128 GB so far.  While that is larger than a dual layer Blu-ray, the current speed is only ~20MB/s as of now.  Less than a 12x Blu-ray player.  They do hope to get speeds up to 300MB/s, but who knows how long that will take (could be around the launch of the next gen systems) or how much those cards would cost.  My guess is that with every new upgrade, the cost would balloon to ~$150-$200 (the price a 128GB currently goes for.  Companies are not going to be waiting around for those cards, at those prices, to base their consoles around.  Not when Blu-ray is getting cheaper quickly and only requires higher speed drives, while using the same discs, to pull off similar performance.

You're completely oblivious to sequential and random read speed. An SD card that has 20 MB random read speed will annihilate a 12X bluray drive. By the time the bluray drive moves the laser, gets up to speed and finds the data, half of the level is laready loaded using SSD.

And its not nearly as expensive as you make it out to seem. USB drives of 16 GB are as low as 15 bucks in Canada. This is retail...I'm sure something that is mass produced like a game cartrige of that size can be brought down even lower.



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will new VAIO getting Windows?
well,if new Xbox using it's good for Sony($$$),and i don't see why Sony reject it(actually,can they reject it?)



disolitude said:
thismeintiel said:
disolitude said:

There is a little too much Sony coolade in your posts my friend...You're the type of dude that defended UMD's cause Sony invented them despite hte fact they were gimping the PSP.

I hope we both get our way next gen. Then you can enjoy your load times and have bluray and I can pay a little more to get games on memory cartriges and have an SSD hard drive in my console of choice...

Seems there is way more anti-Sony Kool-aid (I prefer the name brand) in your posts.  It's funny you speak of load times as if they are god awful this gen and stop people from playing for a greater amount of time.  You must be very impatient if that's how see things.  Then again, if you added up all the load times from playing straight from the disc vs. the time it takes to install the game on a HDD+plus the load times (yea, things still have load times even if installed on the HDD), it probably would take the same amount of time, if not longer, to get through the HDD game.  Either way, load times will be greatly reduced next gen with the advancement of the Blu-ray tech/speed.  But, you just keep drinking your Kool-aid, and I'll continue to enjoy mine.

Edit:  Also forgot to mention that the largest capacity SD cards are 128 GB so far.  While that is larger than a dual layer Blu-ray, the current speed is only ~20MB/s as of now.  Less than a 12x Blu-ray player.  They do hope to get speeds up to 300MB/s, but who knows how long that will take (could be around the launch of the next gen systems) or how much those cards would cost.  My guess is that with every new upgrade, the cost would balloon to ~$150-$200 (the price a 128GB currently goes for.  Companies are not going to be waiting around for those cards, at those prices, to base their consoles around.  Not when Blu-ray is getting cheaper quickly and only requires higher speed drives, while using the same discs, to pull off similar performance.

You're completely oblivious to sequential and random read speed. An SD card that has 20 MB random read speed will annihilate a 12X bluray drive. By the time the bluray drive moves the laser, gets up to speed and finds the data, half of the level is laready loaded using SSD.

And its not nearly as expensive as you make it out to seem. USB drives of 16 GB are as low as 15 bucks in Canada. This is retail...I'm sure something that is mass produced like a game cartrige of that size can be brought down even lower.

No, I'm aware.  You're just blowing the differences out of proportion, as if it would add 5-10 seconds to starting a game.  Most 12x Blu-ray drives have an access time of ~200ms, or .2 seconds.  I hardly believe people would notice, or even give a care about, .2 secs.  I'm sure in 2 years time they can get that cut down quite a bit.  Of course, you also have the fact that random read speeds are nowhere near the top rated speed of the card, which is measured in sequential speed.  As far as price goes, you're talking about a 16GB USB Flash drive that is probably using older tech.  Of course it's going to be cheaper.  But, if you want the fastest SD/SSD speeds to compete and greatly outdo how fast Blu-ray is going to get in 1 1/2 - 2 years time, then they would have to go with the newer, much more expensive tech.

Now, I will agree with you that SSDs will eventually replace HDDs, once price goes down greatly and P/E cycles are extended to almost infinite.  Then again, it may be a hybrid tech like some companies have started using that eventually take over.  Still, we have a good 5-10 years before any company will start putting large capacity ones in their consoles.  Not when a 960GB full SSD costs over $2000.  And even a 1TB hybrid goes for $499, the same price the PS3 launched.  Sure, those may go down by $100 or so when the PS4/NeXbox  launches, but still not cheap enough to warrant Sony or MS shoving one in their console. 

Edit: Also, I am aware those are retail prices.  However, even if mass purchased it may knock, what, $50-$75 dollars off per drive?  It's not like they are going to knock off $200 or more just for Sony or MS.



 

thismeintiel said:
disolitude said:
thismeintiel said:
disolitude said:

There is a little too much Sony coolade in your posts my friend...You're the type of dude that defended UMD's cause Sony invented them despite hte fact they were gimping the PSP.

I hope we both get our way next gen. Then you can enjoy your load times and have bluray and I can pay a little more to get games on memory cartriges and have an SSD hard drive in my console of choice...

Seems there is way more anti-Sony Kool-aid (I prefer the name brand) in your posts.  It's funny you speak of load times as if they are god awful this gen and stop people from playing for a greater amount of time.  You must be very impatient if that's how see things.  Then again, if you added up all the load times from playing straight from the disc vs. the time it takes to install the game on a HDD+plus the load times (yea, things still have load times even if installed on the HDD), it probably would take the same amount of time, if not longer, to get through the HDD game.  Either way, load times will be greatly reduced next gen with the advancement of the Blu-ray tech/speed.  But, you just keep drinking your Kool-aid, and I'll continue to enjoy mine.

Edit:  Also forgot to mention that the largest capacity SD cards are 128 GB so far.  While that is larger than a dual layer Blu-ray, the current speed is only ~20MB/s as of now.  Less than a 12x Blu-ray player.  They do hope to get speeds up to 300MB/s, but who knows how long that will take (could be around the launch of the next gen systems) or how much those cards would cost.  My guess is that with every new upgrade, the cost would balloon to ~$150-$200 (the price a 128GB currently goes for.  Companies are not going to be waiting around for those cards, at those prices, to base their consoles around.  Not when Blu-ray is getting cheaper quickly and only requires higher speed drives, while using the same discs, to pull off similar performance.

You're completely oblivious to sequential and random read speed. An SD card that has 20 MB random read speed will annihilate a 12X bluray drive. By the time the bluray drive moves the laser, gets up to speed and finds the data, half of the level is laready loaded using SSD.

And its not nearly as expensive as you make it out to seem. USB drives of 16 GB are as low as 15 bucks in Canada. This is retail...I'm sure something that is mass produced like a game cartrige of that size can be brought down even lower.

No, I'm aware.  You're just blowing the differences out of proportion, as if it would add 5-10 seconds to starting a game.  Most 12x Blu-ray drives have an access time of ~200ms, or .2 seconds.  I hardly believe people would notice, or even give a care about, .2 secs.  I'm sure in 2 years time they can get that cut down quite a bit.  Of course, you also have the fact that random read speeds are nowhere near the top rated speed of the card, which is measured in sequential speed.  As far as price goes, you're talking about a 16GB USB Flash drive that is probably using older tech.  Of course it's going to be cheaper.  But, if you want the fastest SD/SSD speeds to compete and greatly outdo how fast Blu-ray is going to get in 1 1/2 - 2 years time, then they would have to go with the newer, much more expensive tech.

Now, I will agree with you that SSDs will eventually replace HDDs, once price goes down greatly and P/E cycles are extended to almost infinite.  Then again, it may be a hybrid tech like some companies have started using that eventually take over.  Still, we have a good 5-10 years before any company will start putting large capacity ones in their consoles.  Not when a 960GB full SSD costs over $2000.  And even a 1TB hybrid goes for $499, the same price the PS3 launched.  Sure, those may go down by $100 or so when the PS4/NeXbox  launches, but still not cheap enough to warrant Sony or MS shoving one in their console. 

Edit: Also, I am aware those are retail prices.  However, even if mass purchased it may knock, what, $50-$75 dollars off per drive?  It's not like they are going to knock off $200 or more just for Sony or MS.

why would they need to knock 50-75 dollars off when retail flash memory costs less than dollar per gigabyte?  i am not saying they need to give us solid state terabyte drives next gen, but that games should come on flash carts.

if sony vita games ẅich are prolly between 3 and 6 gigs in size can come on flash memory in size, there is no reason why next gen consoles cant have 10-20 gig flash carts in 2 years for retail games.



disolitude said:

 

why would they need to knock 50-75 dollars off when retail flash memory costs less than dollar per gigabyte?  i am not saying they need to give us solid state terabyte drives next gen, but that games should come on flash carts.

if sony vita games ẅich are prolly between 3 and 6 gigs in size can come on flash memory in size, there is no reason why next gen consoles cant have 10-20 gig flash carts in 2 years for retail games.

I was speaking more of the price of SSDs, not actual flash carts for games.  I say we will still have about 5 years for the new SD specification to reach its full potential and for the benefits to outway the costs.  Another thing is that I doubt Sony or MS would want to go with something like SD cards for their games and would opt to create their own form of flash cart to deter piracy, which would probably drive up costs  a little more, even if they had similar specs to SD.  So we definitely won't see anyone moving in that direction for at least another gen or two. 



LivingMetal said:
selnor said:
PlaystaionGamer said:
i would laugh hard at how many xbox fans will be like 'blu ray is the best! look my xbox has bluray' after all the shade they threw at sony.. it would be interesting..


It wouldnt bother me. If they use it for games so be it. I still wont be buying bLU Ray films. I have 1080p films on Xbox Live. Al of them which are impossible to scratch or break. Wy would I go backwards in my technology just because its there.


Personally, I prefer the 5.1 and 7.1 uncompressed audio and the extras you'd find on an optical disc.  So having more content and higher quality audio going backwards in technology?  You must be humoring yourself.

So Id have to spend more money eitherr renting or buying a Bluray, than what I'm currently doing without the need of a  shop? Without the need to store films? 
Also lately Zunes films have been getting exclusive content like certain Makings, deleted scenes Etc. It tells you on Zune MArketplace when a film has exclusive Zune bonus features not found on the DVD or Bluray. 

Going from the future of tecnology to yesterdays Disc format is backwards. The future will be eavily streaming and downloading, its just a matter of time. So yes Id be going backwards. As I hhave adopted tommorrow early. :)