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Kasz216 said:
richardhutnik said:
Kasz216 said:
badgenome said:
richardhutnik said:

If an industry is requiring people to take out loans that are increasingly getting to be the size of a mortgage, what does one expect the industry to do?

Why are all the protests directed at industry, and not a single one is aimed at the universities who charge an exorbitant amount for a degree of questionable value?

Because they aren't so much mad that they were lied to as they are mad that the lie isn't true.

It would be like being told Santa Claus isn't real as a kid, and not being mad or upset at your parents for lying but being mad at the Macy's Santa for not shelling out for gifts for you.

I'm not even sure it's a "Lie" though.

All I was ever told about college is that if you get a degree is SOMETHING then you are much more likely to get a job.

Which is true, look at the comparative unemployment rates.

If anything I think i'd blame it more on "immortality" syndrome.  I forget what it's really called, but in general the belief that all bad things happen to other people and everything will work out for you because you view yourself as special.

It's like when people who love music and start a band complain because the "music industry is keeping them down and letting no talent hacks make music."


The lies are like this:

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/214426/20110915/unemployment-jobs-economy-college-graduate.htm

The shorthand report over and over and over again is that a B.S degree will make you do better.  It doesn't differentiate between what degree either.   And while what you can say is 100% true, it doesn't mean there aren't other problems also contributing to things.  And yes, people want the lie to be true, because it is comforting to know that it is true.


BS degrees are a lot more then 5% of the population, so i'd say that a BS degree actually does help you to a degree getting employment.

As was stated in this thread, the TYPE of BS degree matters.  And that is what I was trying to address here.  To do a blanket, "get any BS degree" is folly.  It ends up deceiving.



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Occupy Nashville welcomes counter-protesters and let's them on the people's mic:
http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid949801312001?bckey=AQ~~,AAAACEco_Vk~,9bOat4XcfB_88ri1a3UMdKnLpH9aM8Fv&bctid=1257373737001



As civil and heartening as that was, "the people's mic" remains the stupidest fucking thing I've seen in my entire life.



Kasz216 said:
richardhutnik said:
Kasz216 said:
badgenome said:
richardhutnik said:

If an industry is requiring people to take out loans that are increasingly getting to be the size of a mortgage, what does one expect the industry to do?

Why are all the protests directed at industry, and not a single one is aimed at the universities who charge an exorbitant amount for a degree of questionable value?

Because they aren't so much mad that they were lied to as they are mad that the lie isn't true.

It would be like being told Santa Claus isn't real as a kid, and not being mad or upset at your parents for lying but being mad at the Macy's Santa for not shelling out for gifts for you.

I'm not even sure it's a "Lie" though.

All I was ever told about college is that if you get a degree is SOMETHING then you are much more likely to get a job.

Which is true, look at the comparative unemployment rates.

If anything I think i'd blame it more on "immortality" syndrome.  I forget what it's really called, but in general the belief that all bad things happen to other people and everything will work out for you because you view yourself as special.

It's like when people who love music and start a band complain because the "music industry is keeping them down and letting no talent hacks make music."


The lies are like this:

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/214426/20110915/unemployment-jobs-economy-college-graduate.htm

The shorthand report over and over and over again is that a B.S degree will make you do better.  It doesn't differentiate between what degree either.   And while what you can say is 100% true, it doesn't mean there aren't other problems also contributing to things.  And yes, people want the lie to be true, because it is comforting to know that it is true.


BS degrees are a lot more then 5% of the population, so i'd say that a BS degree actually does help you to a degree getting employment.

But being employeed and having a career that makes meaningful use of your (expensive) degree are two very different things. With the number of people I've met with Degrees (often Masters and PHDs) in the humanities and social sciences who are working as baristas or clerks in book stores, it has become clear that there is a lot of degrees where the majority of students are substantially worse off for having gone to university because they're earning (about) as much as a high-school graduate does but have tens of thousands of dollars of debt and lost several years of work experience.



HappySqurriel said:

 

In spite of the massive growth in IT, and the amazing need for people with engineering, math, science and technology degrees, the number of graduates in in-demand fields has remaind stagnant for 30 years while there has been an explosion in "worthless" degrees.


I can honestly say that the vast majority of the people I know out of work are people with computer science degrees. The IT field became over-saturated when the private sectors started slashing entire IT departments. The trickle down effect has been destructive. People who made 100k/yr are taking 40k/yr jobs, and those who normally would be at the skill/experience level of a 40k/yr jobs are now making around 20/k yr working retail jobs.

The end result is a whirlpool of econonic ruin. Less money made = less money to spend = fewer purchases = lower sales = lower business profit = more layoffs.

In fact, I can say that most of my musician friends (ones with actual music degrees) are gainfully employed. The issue at hand is that in the mid 90s and early 200s, there was a big push for computer science degrees, and now its coming  to bite the IT world in the ass.



The Carnival of Shadows - Folk Punk from Asbury Park, New Jersey

http://www.thecarnivalofshadows.com 


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badgenome said:
As civil and heartening as that was, "the people's mic" remains the stupidest fucking thing I've seen in my entire life.


Now now, you can't take that title away from Sarah Palin. Or the Jersey Shore. Or George Bush Jr. Or Emo music.



The Carnival of Shadows - Folk Punk from Asbury Park, New Jersey

http://www.thecarnivalofshadows.com 


Raze said:
badgenome said:
As civil and heartening as that was, "the people's mic" remains the stupidest fucking thing I've seen in my entire life.


Now now, you can't take that title away from Sarah Palin. Or the Jersey Shore. Or George Bush Jr. Or Emo music.

If you combined all that shit, plus the video in the OP, plus every Sony worship thread made by Marco, it'd still be slightly dumber.



Raze said:
HappySqurriel said:

 

In spite of the massive growth in IT, and the amazing need for people with engineering, math, science and technology degrees, the number of graduates in in-demand fields has remaind stagnant for 30 years while there has been an explosion in "worthless" degrees.


I can honestly say that the vast majority of the people I know out of work are people with computer science degrees. The IT field became over-saturated when the private sectors started slashing entire IT departments. The trickle down effect has been destructive. People who made 100k/yr are taking 40k/yr jobs, and those who normally would be at the skill/experience level of a 40k/yr jobs are now making around 20/k yr working retail jobs.

The end result is a whirlpool of econonic ruin. Less money made = less money to spend = fewer purchases = lower sales = lower business profit = more layoffs.

In fact, I can say that most of my musician friends (ones with actual music degrees) are gainfully employed. The issue at hand is that in the mid 90s and early 200s, there was a big push for computer science degrees, and now its coming  to bite the IT world in the ass.

 

All I know for sure is that my company would hire several new developers today if we could find qualified people; and most of the people I know at other companies are in a similar position ...

It is remarkable the contrast between what we're getting as responses to developer positions and what we get when we have an open data-entry position. With developers we're dealing with recruiters and candidates themselves and we can get a handful of responses after a month, most of which lack the technical and/or interpersonal skills to be successful in our company; at the same time, when we post a job for a data-entry clerk we will get dozens of responses a week, and most of them have university degrees.

 

While I could be wrong, I suspect the reason why there are a lot of computer science grads who are unemployeed and may never find a job in the field is that they're seen as being unqualified for the jobs that are available; not that jobs aren't there. (At least from what I saw in school) Computer science is a field where cheaters and sponges have been remarkably successful at getting through school with how assignment based most of the classes are, and as a result you have to be very careful to see if an applicant knows what they're talking about in an interview when you hire them. If you're dealing with a new grad who claims to be an expert in "object oriented programming" and he can't answer simple questions like "What's the difference between a class and an object?" or "Name and describe some of the princples of OOP?" odds are he won't get the job.



badgenome said:
Raze said:
badgenome said:
As civil and heartening as that was, "the people's mic" remains the stupidest fucking thing I've seen in my entire life.


Now now, you can't take that title away from Sarah Palin. Or the Jersey Shore. Or George Bush Jr. Or Emo music.

If you combined all that shit, plus the video in the OP, plus every Sony worship thread made by Marco, it'd still be slightly dumber.

Ok, now I know you are out of your right mind. Nothing, and I mean NOTHING is dumber than the Jersey Shore. I don't care who you are or what walk of life you're on. You need psycholgical help. =p



The Carnival of Shadows - Folk Punk from Asbury Park, New Jersey

http://www.thecarnivalofshadows.com 


badgenome said:
As civil and heartening as that was, "the people's mic" remains the stupidest fucking thing I've seen in my entire life.

When you are not allowed to bring in a sound system, mic/speaker or even a bullhorn, there is a need to have a way to address a large crowd.  The people's mic  is a work around that works in regards to this.  If it is the only think that people only use, that is stupid, but what other solution do you propose when you can't have a sound system to enable to address a large crowd?  Even when there is a sound system, if the crowd gets real loud, people still can't hear way in back.