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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Windows Phone 7 is Struggling Says Steve Balmer

oniyide on 18 July 2011

At least he is keeping it real, and not saying crap like "our OS is better and our phones are better". I gotta respect this guy



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richardhutnik on 18 July 2011

Oh well, I guess Microsoft is finding its name, and supposedly tying to XBox Live, and that brand, complete with them advertising "Hot Apps" over Live isn't helping much to make them a player. In areas where they don't have ties to the desktop, they run into major issues.



TRios_Zen on 18 July 2011

I got a WP7 to replace my old blackberry and I am happy with the change. I also prefer my OS to my wife's android phone, so I would be disappointed if it didn't last.



famousringo on 19 July 2011
Zlejedi said:
famousringo said:
Yep, the problem is that Android got there with a modular OS solution first. 

As OS vendors, Google and Microsoft aren't exactly selling to customers, they're selling to handset manufacturers and the carriers who contract them. Android offers a more established ecosystem, an OS which can be customized with UIs and pre-loaded software for differentiation, and does it at the low price of free (though usually the manufacturer chooses to pay for licensed Google apps). Even if a manufacturer were looking at each platform fresh, Android looks more attractive, and then you consider that most of them have already invested a lot of R&D working on Android handsets.

Other than the Nokia deal, the only other big asset Microsoft has is that the price of Android keeps creeping up as Android vendors keep losing lawsuits. Sometimes free isn't so free, and it's easy to see how a manufacturer might decide to take shelter under Microsoft's umbrella rather than paying to fight Google's legal battles.

Guys don't forget that:

1. You can only buy iOS with expensive phone

2. W7P also has not so small minimal requirments

3. Android runs on almost everything which means their phones are cheapest


The price of a smartphone pales in comparison to the price of a data contract, even in regions that don't subsidize the phone. Apple offers a cheaper iPhone, and it serves some buyers well, but most customers skip right past it and pay marginally more for the latest and greatest model. Hell, you can get a Blackberry for a little over a hundred bucks, but it isn't doing RIM much good right now. Until the cost of phone data falls a lot lower, I don't think price will be as important a competitive factor as features and ecosystem.

I'm also not sure how valuable the customers who buy cheap are. I'm not just talking about the initial handset revenue. Judging by browser usage and app sales, a lot of people are using their smartphones as kickass feature phones. A sale is a sale, but people who don't download software are people with few reasons not to switch to another brand the next time their contract comes up.



"The worst part about these reviews is they are [subjective]--and their scores often depend on how drunk you got the media at a Street Fighter event."  — Mona Hamilton, Capcom Senior VP of Marketing
*Image indefinitely borrowed from BrainBoxLtd without his consent.

Zlejedi on 19 July 2011
famousringo said:
Zlejedi said:
famousringo said:
Yep, the problem is that Android got there with a modular OS solution first. 

As OS vendors, Google and Microsoft aren't exactly selling to customers, they're selling to handset manufacturers and the carriers who contract them. Android offers a more established ecosystem, an OS which can be customized with UIs and pre-loaded software for differentiation, and does it at the low price of free (though usually the manufacturer chooses to pay for licensed Google apps). Even if a manufacturer were looking at each platform fresh, Android looks more attractive, and then you consider that most of them have already invested a lot of R&D working on Android handsets.

Other than the Nokia deal, the only other big asset Microsoft has is that the price of Android keeps creeping up as Android vendors keep losing lawsuits. Sometimes free isn't so free, and it's easy to see how a manufacturer might decide to take shelter under Microsoft's umbrella rather than paying to fight Google's legal battles.

Guys don't forget that:

1. You can only buy iOS with expensive phone

2. W7P also has not so small minimal requirments

3. Android runs on almost everything which means their phones are cheapest


The price of a smartphone pales in comparison to the price of a data contract, even in regions that don't subsidize the phone. Apple offers a cheaper iPhone, and it serves some buyers well, but most customers skip right past it and pay marginally more for the latest and greatest model. Hell, you can get a Blackberry for a little over a hundred bucks, but it isn't doing RIM much good right now. Until the cost of phone data falls a lot lower, I don't think price will be as important a competitive factor as features and ecosystem.

I'm also not sure how valuable the customers who buy cheap are. I'm not just talking about the initial handset revenue. Judging by browser usage and app sales, a lot of people are using their smartphones as kickass feature phones. A sale is a sale, but people who don't download software are people with few reasons not to switch to another brand the next time their contract comes up.

I think you have it completly wrong.

Data transfer is reasonably cheap - data plans are expensive because you have to subsidiaze $500 phones with them in two years.

We have plenty of cheap 15-20 euro/month plans with low end android phones in here.

And if i brough my own smartphone into the network i could get 500 MB for like 7 euro per month



PROUD MEMBER OF THE PSP RPG FAN CLUB

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IamAwsome on 19 July 2011

I think that WP7 will rise in the next few years because of Nokia's brand appeal, and the numerous Android lawsuits. iOS will stay firmly at #2, and will go head to head with WP7 after Nokia, has set in. I don't think that iOS will drop anymore after it hits more carriers, and Apple releases the long rumored prepaid model.

Android on the other hand will probably rise for now, but drop, after Nokia comes in and establishes its partnership with Microsoft. Android will probably drop due to the lawsuits, and various fragmentation issues which may cause users to migrate to the other two.



famousringo on 19 July 2011
Zlejedi said:
famousringo said:

The price of a smartphone pales in comparison to the price of a data contract, even in regions that don't subsidize the phone. Apple offers a cheaper iPhone, and it serves some buyers well, but most customers skip right past it and pay marginally more for the latest and greatest model. Hell, you can get a Blackberry for a little over a hundred bucks, but it isn't doing RIM much good right now. Until the cost of phone data falls a lot lower, I don't think price will be as important a competitive factor as features and ecosystem.

I'm also not sure how valuable the customers who buy cheap are. I'm not just talking about the initial handset revenue. Judging by browser usage and app sales, a lot of people are using their smartphones as kickass feature phones. A sale is a sale, but people who don't download software are people with few reasons not to switch to another brand the next time their contract comes up.

I think you have it completly wrong.

Data transfer is reasonably cheap - data plans are expensive because you have to subsidiaze $500 phones with them in two years.

We have plenty of cheap 15-20 euro/month plans with low end android phones in here.

And if i brough my own smartphone into the network i could get 500 MB for like 7 euro per month

That's 7 Euro just for data, right? You need to buy voice/ SMS/whatever else you want on top of it?

Still, that's a great deal. Here in Canada, you can't get a smartphone contract for much less than $60 for three years, and only about $13 of that is subsidizing the phone. US rates aren't much cheaper, last I saw.

So if phone plans are so much cheaper in Europe, why isn't Android doing better worldwide than it is in expensive North America? If you take Nokia's market share out of the picture, Android claims roughly the same market share as it does in the US. A little under, actually. Shouldn't cheap data, cheap phones, and Android's strong ecosystem and feature set be driving it faster in Europe?

Sources:

http://www.businessinsider.com/android-us-marketshare-2011-6

http://www.mobileeurope.co.uk/news/news-anaylsis/8639-android-surges-ahead-in-europe-



"The worst part about these reviews is they are [subjective]--and their scores often depend on how drunk you got the media at a Street Fighter event."  — Mona Hamilton, Capcom Senior VP of Marketing
*Image indefinitely borrowed from BrainBoxLtd without his consent.

Mad55 on 19 July 2011

plenty of removed posts i see. well it doesnt look to great to me so idk.



selnor on 19 July 2011

Microsoft just need to keep plugging away. Everyone that has switched or tried wp7 think its great. Wp7 handsets top 3 major EU user review sites to. Nokia will help loads. Even now they still sell the most handsets in the world. And in China Boone can touch Nokia. If MS get Nokia wp7 into China, wp7 worldwide marketshare will increase rapidly. EU also still has alot of Nokia loyalty fans. At my work place we have 2 wp7s, 9 IOS and 14 nokias. I know alot who will upgrade to Nokia wp7. Wp7 will pick up steam over the next 12 months.



Zlejedi on 20 July 2011
famousringo said:
Zlejedi said:
famousringo said:

The price of a smartphone pales in comparison to the price of a data contract, even in regions that don't subsidize the phone. Apple offers a cheaper iPhone, and it serves some buyers well, but most customers skip right past it and pay marginally more for the latest and greatest model. Hell, you can get a Blackberry for a little over a hundred bucks, but it isn't doing RIM much good right now. Until the cost of phone data falls a lot lower, I don't think price will be as important a competitive factor as features and ecosystem.

I'm also not sure how valuable the customers who buy cheap are. I'm not just talking about the initial handset revenue. Judging by browser usage and app sales, a lot of people are using their smartphones as kickass feature phones. A sale is a sale, but people who don't download software are people with few reasons not to switch to another brand the next time their contract comes up.

I think you have it completly wrong.

Data transfer is reasonably cheap - data plans are expensive because you have to subsidiaze $500 phones with them in two years.

We have plenty of cheap 15-20 euro/month plans with low end android phones in here.

And if i brough my own smartphone into the network i could get 500 MB for like 7 euro per month

That's 7 Euro just for data, right? You need to buy voice/ SMS/whatever else you want on top of it?

Still, that's a great deal. Here in Canada, you can't get a smartphone contract for much less than $60 for three years, and only about $13 of that is subsidizing the phone. US rates aren't much cheaper, last I saw.

So if phone plans are so much cheaper in Europe, why isn't Android doing better worldwide than it is in expensive North America? If you take Nokia's market share out of the picture, Android claims roughly the same market share as it does in the US. A little under, actually. Shouldn't cheap data, cheap phones, and Android's strong ecosystem and feature set be driving it faster in Europe?

Sources:

http://www.businessinsider.com/android-us-marketshare-2011-6

http://www.mobileeurope.co.uk/news/news-anaylsis/8639-android-surges-ahead-in-europe-


Yes cheapest voice plans are in 6-7 euro range too ;) If you took only 100MB/month option to it you could stay in 10 euro total.

And note how much market share symbian has - those phones can be cheap too.



PROUD MEMBER OF THE PSP RPG FAN CLUB