| Tiwaz said: Ah well dynamic IPs for the win! |
WTF!?
Dynamic IPs are simply an address offered to you by your ISP - They still have your details using any of those dynamic IPs...
You is noob! lol
| huaxiong90 said: Oh man...I don't like where this is headed... |
i wasn't expecting this opone reading the thread title but i'd have to second your post.
theprof00 said:
I just want to be sure my comprehension is sound, so feel free to correct me. You're implying, based on this and past posts in the thread, that these reasons are so much of a stretch that the only logical use would be to pursue the individual IPs? If not, well I kind of agree. I wouldn't call it a stretch, but I wouldn't call it a favorable position either. It's too early to call the case and how this evidence will affect it (even if this succeeds and it moves to CA, a CA judge might find for the defendant). My stance on this is that this is the legal system and the way it works. Maybe IP laws need retooling, or the legal system does, but I don't anything particularly eggregious here specifically. It is reasonable that a company whose product is being cracked should be able to fight back, and I would see non-pursuance of these IPs as self-handicapping. |
You're obviously an educated guy as your command of the english language is pretty high up there relatively speaking. I find your stance remarkably suspicious considering what's at stake here. Yes it is reasonable for a company to fight and defend it's IPs (pun intended) but getting data released on people who have not been tried in court and where there isn't reasonable proof to suspect those people of a wrongdoing is plain bullshit, clear as anything.
I would say that if Microsoft were pulling this sort of stunt, the same people defending Sony here would be on the issue like flies on shit. Nothing wrong with being biased and ignorant but most of you here seem to actually have some level of intelligence and know right from wrong. But you're swallowing your morals for the sake of selfish greed. Your not fanboys, your even worse and to be honest should be ashamed and know better.
It would be quite funny to see a company use these kind of tactics on one of you when you haven't been found guilty of a crime and see your reaction then.
Get some bloody empathy! these are normal people who like tinkering with stuff - end of story. It's a disgrace that you people are so against these "hackers". You're siding with a company that is looking out for monetery interests over a person who has been messing around and is being fucked by said company and can't pay the bills to defend himself!!!
WAKE UP!
theprof00 said:
I just want to be sure my comprehension is sound, so feel free to correct me. You're implying, based on this and past posts in the thread, that these reasons are so much of a stretch that the only logical use would be to pursue the individual IPs? If not, well I kind of agree. I wouldn't call it a stretch, but I wouldn't call it a favorable position either. It's too early to call the case and how this evidence will affect it (even if this succeeds and it moves to CA, a CA judge might find for the defendant). My stance on this is that this is the legal system and the way it works. Maybe IP laws need retooling, or the legal system does, but I don't anything particularly eggregious here specifically. It is reasonable that a company whose product is being cracked should be able to fight back, and I would see non-pursuance of these IPs as self-handicapping. |
It's not really the only logical use, but it's THE most logical use, and most likely use since that's what Sony originally wanted the supeona's for, though were denied specifically because, the codes sony are looking for aren't in of themselves illegal but only illegal when applied to your PS3. The data does have some vague use, though it's not really huge uses.
Think about it this way, Automatic weapons are illegal in the United States. You can order gun modification kits to make guns automatic, from companies. These places never get prosecuted specifically because unless it is used to be modified in an automatic rifle, it's just a bar and an instruction booklet. It's basically impossible to prove large scale distribution. Just as it would be to use the IP logs.
As for, Sony prosecuting the case.
Sure, if they do it in New Jersey.
Though their does need to be reform just based on the fact that coroporations have ridiculious levels of resources.
Afterall the RIAA has pretty much lost every file sharing case that has gone to trial, the issue however is that it rarely reaches trial because the individuals they sue don't have the resources needed to compete with corporate lawyers and stall tactics.
Which is what makes this case a good one in general, that people were more or less willing to give money to him so he could have a *somewhat* fair trial.
Either sony entered this lawsuit without enough proof to convict him or is just trying to drain him of resources. Either way it basically shows Sony's plan was for this to not reach trial.
In otherwords, it's stuff that's vaguely in the framework of the laws, but in general, pretty damn unethical when it would be perfectly possible for Sony to prosecute in an ethical way.
buglebum said:
Dynamic IPs are simply an address offered to you by your ISP - They still have your details using any of those dynamic IPs...
You is noob! lol |
Yes I know that lol.
You probably didn't got what I was trying to say. I understand why you misunderstood me. My translation probably was not good. Do not take it personally, but I'm not going to try to translate what I meant here. Because it will take all my English to the limit. I not feel like that at the moment lol.
May the adjustments be with you
I feel a disturbance in the sales
I just want to state for both bublgum and kasz that if Sony prosecuted any of these individual IP holders (even if they are members of failoverflow, or another group) I would be vehemently against it.
I am actually for hacking and tinkering. I'm also for piracy. I'm for a lot of things that could be considered disreputable because I believe in the free market. I believe there is a way to cohabitate with piracy and hacking, but we are not there yet.
Possibly, with hacking and piracy prevalent, the pressure could help force this evolution in strategy. However, at this point, it is very much counterproductive. Companies are looking at ever more ingenious ways to limit capability in order to stop piracy.
For example, my ps3 just yellow-lighted. If I were to send it in for repair, I would lose all my data because 99% of the time, the provide a refurb unit, and if I hang onto my hard-drive and try it in the new unit, it will format the HDD. The idea is that HDD is tied specifically to one motherboard. That is an anti-piracy measure. That is something I disagree with.
Same goes with weed. I believe weed is a harmless drug that should be legalized for myriad reasons.
Rambling aside, the point is that while I am for hacking, and piracy, and some low class drugs, I also understand how RISKY these things are. At any point, I could be arrested or sued for doing any of these things, and I understand that. I understand both sides.
While I sympathize with these hackers, I am not so blind in that 'bias' that I don't see the reality around me. These people work outside the law. Jailbreaking a phone, for example, only became legal AFTER they got in trouble. Hackers are very much walking a thin and faint line. At any point they could cross the line.
For example, when geohot hacked the system, he said something along the lines of, "I showed them how I broke it, and left it out there to show them how they could fix it". I mean, how does that make sense, geohot? In your mind, how can you possibly think that that is OK? You're basically making them spend more and more money to fix problems that you created! Additionally, it's only hurting the people out there who are using their product within guidelines. We all lost other OS because of that.
Hacking is going to get to the point where all software is going to require internet connection to test validity every so often during use. I don't know whether this is the "game" hackers are playing; a test of strength between opponents in the cyber-battlefield, but it's hurting consumers. It's hurting consumers by making companies spend more for the product and passing the costs onto us. It's hurting the product by adding development time.
Hacking as it is now, is unsustainable. There needs to be real action, not just "I break this, and let's test out who is right in court". There needs to be a movement in the digital frontier. Something that commands power, and not just something that undermines it.
The hackers need to demonstrate how hacking is beneficial. For example, a game's value can be improved by modding and selective hacking.
This is not what Geohot did with the ps3. He hurt the product immensely.
| theprof00 said: I just want to state for both bublgum and kasz that if Sony prosecuted any of these individual IP holders (even if they are members of failoverflow, or another group) I would be vehemently against it. I am actually for hacking and tinkering. I'm also for piracy. I'm for a lot of things that could be considered disreputable because I believe in the free market. I believe there is a way to cohabitate with piracy and hacking, but we are not there yet. Possibly, with hacking and piracy prevalent, the pressure could help force this evolution in strategy. However, at this point, it is very much counterproductive. Companies are looking at ever more ingenious ways to limit capability in order to stop piracy. For example, my ps3 just yellow-lighted. If I were to send it in for repair, I would lose all my data because 99% of the time, the provide a refurb unit, and if I hang onto my hard-drive and try it in the new unit, it will format the HDD. The idea is that HDD is tied specifically to one motherboard. That is an anti-piracy measure. That is something I disagree with. Same goes with weed. I believe weed is a harmless drug that should be legalized for myriad reasons. Rambling aside, the point is that while I am for hacking, and piracy, and some low class drugs, I also understand how RISKY these things are. At any point, I could be arrested or sued for doing any of these things, and I understand that. I understand both sides. While I sympathize with these hackers, I am not so blind in that 'bias' that I don't see the reality around me. These people work outside the law. Jailbreaking a phone, for example, only became legal AFTER they got in trouble. Hackers are very much walking a thin and faint line. At any point they could cross the line. For example, when geohot hacked the system, he said something along the lines of, "I showed them how I broke it, and left it out there to show them how they could fix it". I mean, how does that make sense, geohot? In your mind, how can you possibly think that that is OK? You're basically making them spend more and more money to fix problems that you created! Additionally, it's only hurting the people out there who are using their product within guidelines. We all lost other OS because of that. Hacking is going to get to the point where all software is going to require internet connection to test validity every so often during use. I don't know whether this is the "game" hackers are playing; a test of strength between opponents in the cyber-battlefield, but it's hurting consumers. It's hurting consumers by making companies spend more for the product and passing the costs onto us. It's hurting the product by adding development time. Hacking as it is now, is unsustainable. There needs to be real action, not just "I break this, and let's test out who is right in court". There needs to be a movement in the digital frontier. Something that commands power, and not just something that undermines it. The hackers need to demonstrate how hacking is beneficial. For example, a game's value can be improved by modding and selective hacking. This is not what Geohot did with the ps3. He hurt the product immensely. |
i applaud you
“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”
- George Orwell, ‘1984’
Porcupine_I said:
i applaud you |
be honest, that's the only part you read 
| theprof00 said: I just want to state for both bublgum and kasz that if Sony prosecuted any of these individual IP holders (even if they are members of failoverflow, or another group) I would be vehemently against it. I am actually for hacking and tinkering. I'm also for piracy. I'm for a lot of things that could be considered disreputable because I believe in the free market. I believe there is a way to cohabitate with piracy and hacking, but we are not there yet. Possibly, with hacking and piracy prevalent, the pressure could help force this evolution in strategy. However, at this point, it is very much counterproductive. Companies are looking at ever more ingenious ways to limit capability in order to stop piracy. For example, my ps3 just yellow-lighted. If I were to send it in for repair, I would lose all my data because 99% of the time, the provide a refurb unit, and if I hang onto my hard-drive and try it in the new unit, it will format the HDD. The idea is that HDD is tied specifically to one motherboard. That is an anti-piracy measure. That is something I disagree with. Same goes with weed. I believe weed is a harmless drug that should be legalized for myriad reasons. Rambling aside, the point is that while I am for hacking, and piracy, and some low class drugs, I also understand how RISKY these things are. At any point, I could be arrested or sued for doing any of these things, and I understand that. I understand both sides. While I sympathize with these hackers, I am not so blind in that 'bias' that I don't see the reality around me. These people work outside the law. Jailbreaking a phone, for example, only became legal AFTER they got in trouble. Hackers are very much walking a thin and faint line. At any point they could cross the line. For example, when geohot hacked the system, he said something along the lines of, "I showed them how I broke it, and left it out there to show them how they could fix it". I mean, how does that make sense, geohot? In your mind, how can you possibly think that that is OK? You're basically making them spend more and more money to fix problems that you created! Additionally, it's only hurting the people out there who are using their product within guidelines. We all lost other OS because of that. Hacking is going to get to the point where all software is going to require internet connection to test validity every so often during use. I don't know whether this is the "game" hackers are playing; a test of strength between opponents in the cyber-battlefield, but it's hurting consumers. It's hurting consumers by making companies spend more for the product and passing the costs onto us. It's hurting the product by adding development time. Hacking as it is now, is unsustainable. There needs to be real action, not just "I break this, and let's test out who is right in court". There needs to be a movement in the digital frontier. Something that commands power, and not just something that undermines it. The hackers need to demonstrate how hacking is beneficial. For example, a game's value can be improved by modding and selective hacking. This is not what Geohot did with the ps3. He hurt the product immensely. |
A) He did provide changes that improved the function of the PS3 though. It runs homebrew aps now, can get back linux, and you can basically treat your PS3 like any other computer now.
Everything negative that happened afterwords were the direct actions of other people.
B) The Iphone case became legal afterwords, because it was found the law that was being applied was illegal. Considering hackers don't have lobbisets, this is literally all they can do, do it anyway, and then show how said law they are persecuted under breaks a number of civil libreties.
theprof00 said:
|
to be honest! that's the only part i ignored :P
“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”
- George Orwell, ‘1984’
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