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Against the grain: Why do we Europeans hate RPG's?

Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Against the grain: Why do we Europeans hate RPG's?

A203D said:
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You are somewhat right but the is a bit more to it then that, like you said gameplay is one main factor but people in Europe have a varied taste that seems to be determined by multiple factor. Dragon Quest is increasing in popularity even to the point that we're buying more then the US with in one game being released because it had a unique style, well developed, interesting quirks of it's own over other rpgs, is marketed well and evolves well with each insatallment while maintaining it's tradition, it even uses British English which Europeans are more used and accustomed to, in Europe we tend to like games that have interesting Quirks, Pokemon is one example.

 

I think the number one issue first of all before you tackle everything else is that in Europe you have to make yourself known and market your product as the are a lot of avid gamers here who may only pop into the store every now and then and don't visit forums and such, gaming is just a common past time here much like football, many people support teams but don't know much about the game. They may see your game in the store but not know what it's about, as long as the gameplay is at a decent level you'll get a foothold in gaining/starting a fanbase, the are more then enough rpg fans in Europe just market your game even if some people say it's not what they expected the are going to be people in there who still like what they're playing after all FF is still going.



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Didn't people learn in PS2 era that region lock=bad things for european jrpg fans?

 

And well not getting current gen rpgs seems to be mostly Wii problem all titles that were released in us for ps3/x360 have sooner or later found their way here.



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I believe us Europeans don't regard JRPGs too highly, I believe most Europeans think they're boring or otherwise bad. They're mostly the same and when they're not, they're either too niche or the changes are bad.



As I see it there were 3 major set backs for JRPGs releases in Europe in the past first was high costs of English and other European Language localization with a niche genre. The second the fact the Europe is PAL when Japan and the US/Canada are NTSC-J and NTSC-U/C respectively. From what I remember the Japanese could convert there games to NTSC-U/C for very little cost compared to PAL.  

The third was and still is to this day Marketing JRPGs are not really get that much in the way of marketing exposure outside of Final Fantasy and Pokemon in Europe that they do in Japan in the US it is a little better but not much.           



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I always get the feeling that RPGs (bar Pokemon) still contain many negative connotations in the UK (and probably the rest of Europe?). They require a lot of time to be put aside to play them, and it still isn't widely accepted that games should do this.



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Chibi.V.29 said:


pokemon is a reeeealy abd example as its the most un inotive game on earh. if you play the first you retty much know how the play the next 1560 of them. FF13 is a bit over 20% behind ff10 despite that fact there was a long 5 (long time for any series) year break its still actually selling every week (i expect it to be 15% behind by end of its life). which isnt bad considering it was released another 10 years after 10 (most series dont even last 10 years to begin with). if i can asume it will drop another 15% every 10 years then i consider that in incredible successes (already is for only falling by that in the last decade)

And i dont think tls will do well in europe. the simple fact is most of the gamers in Europe (and very much so in the uk) dont like long often very stretched out games. Though i am used to this strute that rpg's have and enjoy it myself TLS does the same as every other rpg in the sense that its filled with fillers. just as almost all jrpg's are these days (though i personaly enjoy the detractions)

Thats not the point - it dosent have to be innovative. every year COD is released, its not innovate, its the same type of game, same controls, same gameplay, same length, same multiplayer, etc. its accessible. people know what they see is what they get. so 15 mil people buy it again and again.

the point about Pokemon, is it dosent have to be innovative, it has to be accesssible, so people see it in a shop, they know what it is, and they play it. simple as. with RPGs people dont know what it is. they dont think that type of game is fun -  Pokemon is fun because it is different from other JRPGs - it has its own set of rules. FF is the exception because FF7 established the series many years ago in Europe and the US.

my point is games like TLS, Dragon Quest and now even WPRGs like Mass Effect have a chance of making inroads in the RPG genre because people can see what they're going to get. they know they're going to get high octane action, maybe some online play, real time combat - not the turn based stuff western gamers would find boring, so there is a real chance. this talks to the western gamers in their language - if you know what i mean.

i'm not turning this into a thread about FF13s sales, but i think something needs to change, or even FF10s sales will be a distant memory, considering its been over 10 years since FF7 sold about 10mil.



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Wyrdness said:
A203D said:
...

You are somewhat right but the is a bit more to it then that, like you said gameplay is one main factor but people in Europe have a varied taste that seems to be determined by multiple factor. Dragon Quest is increasing in popularity even to the point that we're buying more then the US with in one game being released because it had a unique style, well developed, interesting quirks of it's own over other rpgs, is marketed well and evolves well with each insatallment while maintaining it's tradition, it even uses British English which Europeans are more used and accustomed to, in Europe we tend to like games that have interesting Quirks, Pokemon is one example.

 

I think the number one issue first of all before you tackle everything else is that in Europe you have to make yourself known and market your product as the are a lot of avid gamers here who may only pop into the store every now and then and don't visit forums and such, gaming is just a common past time here much like football, many people support teams but don't know much about the game. They may see your game in the store but not know what it's about, as long as the gameplay is at a decent level you'll get a foothold in gaining/starting a fanbase, the are more then enough rpg fans in Europe just market your game even if some people say it's not what they expected the are going to be people in there who still like what they're playing after all FF is still going.

Yeah i honestly think that Dragon Quest 8 and Final Fantasy 12 that came out at the end of the PS2 lifecycle, SE had nailed it. no more poor dialogue, brilliant English voice acting. those 2 games were brilliant RPGs - but at the end of the day the gameplay was to complex, too hard, to slow, too boring or too long.

i mean DQ8 was turn based, in Europe i dont think many gamers accept that. there were so many battles, you had to level grind a LOT, same for FF12. the Gamit system in FF12 was way too complex, no western gamer who has not much knowledge in RPGs in going to be able to come into that - they would be overwhealmed. not to mention very long dungeons.

my point is that i think if you make the gameplay more accessible to gamers you will get the sales. just like ME has been a success for an RPG in the US. not so much in Europe, but getting there. and Pokemon is another example of a successful RPG, because it makes its own rules, it dosent conform to the standards of long cutscenes, American voice acting, etc. this is why i think TLS could end up being a moderate success in Europe - its adpats to change in my personal opinion.



we have higher standards for story telling?



                                                                           

hikaruchan said:

Europeans don't like Cutscene heavy Games MGS says HI. 

I'm talking about RPGs. MG is an established series, since the NES/SNES. and MGS is a tactical action game. the cutscenes are also very different. what other game as Kojima made that has been met with the same success??

point being its an action game, it talks to the users in a lanuage they understand, RPGs are more complex in that respect. the vast amount of cutscenes suppliment the fear they have of the game being boring.

i'm not saying you cant have a lot of cutscenes in RPGs, i'm saying its a combination of cutscenes, gameplay, characters, voice acting that people here in Europe dont trust JRPGs.

but there is a small and loyal fanbase, for games like Valkyria Chronicles, or people who watch anime. European gamers dont play games for cutscenes. eg GTA, how many people do you think actully finish it or even play it. loads of people just buy it so they can drive around, play a few missions, mess about with the guns, put it back on the shelf.

so in RPGs cutscenes are only part of problem, because gamers dont know what to expect, with MGS everyone knows what it is. besides, MGS's sales declined and never recovered after the 4th installment MGS2.