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Forums - General Discussion - Taliban stoning to death of man and woman for adultery

Chairman-Mao on 01 February 2011
sapphi_snake said:
Chairman-Mao said:
highwaystar101 said:
Chairman-Mao said:

Look I know their society seems backwards to us with laws like this, but even so; the law is the law. She knew adultery was wrong in her society and she chose to do it anyways and paid for it. 

Maybe there's a society out there where stealing isn't wrong and they think we're retarded for punishing thieves?


Except it's not the law, and that was clear in the article. It was an illegal stoning carried out by a terrorist group, not as a product of the justice system. The people who carried out the stoning are now wanted men.

That's not to say stoning isn't part of the justice system in other countries, because it is, and that's something that I and much of the world find disturbing.

And I do respect your approach to moral relativism, but you're still allowed to be outraged from a personal point of view, even though there is no set code of morals that all societies can live by. And pushing to get unreasonable laws with inhumane punishments revoked has been something mankind has always benefited from.


I didn't realize that (the part I underlined). In that case I will take back what I said.

I do however stand by a nation's right to sovereignty as long as its "legal" (passed by their legitimate government). 

So I assume you support the Holocaust, no? That was passed by a legitimate Government also.

Even though that's a lame post that hardly dignifies a response I'll say the same thing I said to Joecool7. The attempted killing of an entire race (genocide) is not even remotely similar to a law concerning adultery. Of course we have to step in and stop genocide attempts. 

How would you like it if whatever country you were from suddenly became weak and the US or China or whoever decided to come in and force you to change all your laws to their liking? Do you want some other country telling you that you can't do this and can't do that but have to do this...?



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sapphi_snake on 01 February 2011
Chairman-Mao said:

Even though that's a lame post that hardly dignifies a response I'll say the same thing I said to Joecool7. The attempted killing of an entire race (genocide) is not even remotely similar to a law concerning adultery. Of course we have to step in and stop genocide attempts. 

How would you like it if whatever country you were from suddenly became weak and the US or China or whoever decided to come in and force you to change all your laws to their liking? Do you want some other country telling you that you can't do this and can't do that but have to do this...?

Don't be upset, and don't insult my post. It's not my fault that you're inconsitent.

This mere law you're talking about implies torturing and killing people because of adultery. It's inhumane and should not be happening ANYWHERE! Just because some backwards society made it one of their laws doesn't make it right. And if you're advocating for such cultural relativism, then you shouldn't have anything against the Holocaust. After all, it was a policy created by the German state, and the general population seemed to agree with it (didn't see them rising up and protesting against it). This policy was also a high point of a cultural phenomenon that began in the Middle Ages and was made popular by Chrsitians, so it could definately be viewed as being compatible with the culture of Germany.

Stop being a hypocrite. Either you're for cultural relativism of this level, or you're against it.



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rocketpig on 01 February 2011
Chairman-Mao said:

Look I know their society seems backwards to us with laws like this, but even so; the law is the law. She knew adultery was wrong in her society and she chose to do it anyways and paid for it. 

Maybe there's a society out there where stealing isn't wrong and they think we're retarded for punishing thieves?

Having different opinions on culture and tolerating unimaginable and unnecessary cruelty are very different things.

I don't see anyone arguing whether adultery should be legal or not in Afghanistan... on the other hand, brutally stoning people to death should not be considered acceptable in 2011.




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rocketpig on 01 February 2011
Chairman-Mao said:
highwaystar101 said:
Chairman-Mao said:

Look I know their society seems backwards to us with laws like this, but even so; the law is the law. She knew adultery was wrong in her society and she chose to do it anyways and paid for it. 

Maybe there's a society out there where stealing isn't wrong and they think we're retarded for punishing thieves?


Except it's not the law, and that was clear in the article. It was an illegal stoning carried out by a terrorist group, not as a product of the justice system. The people who carried out the stoning are now wanted men.

That's not to say stoning isn't part of the justice system in other countries, because it is, and that's something that I and much of the world find disturbing.

And I do respect your approach to moral relativism, but you're still allowed to be outraged from a personal point of view, even though there is no set code of morals that all societies can live by. And pushing to get unreasonable laws with inhumane punishments revoked has been something mankind has always benefited from.


I didn't realize that (the part I underlined). In that case I will take back what I said.

I do however stand by a nation's right to sovereignty as long as its "legal" (passed by their legitimate government). 

So, tell me what you think of Rwanda, Darfur, or mid-90s Bosnia. I'm dying to hear your opinion.




Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/

Chairman-Mao on 01 February 2011
sapphi_snake said:
Chairman-Mao said:

Even though that's a lame post that hardly dignifies a response I'll say the same thing I said to Joecool7. The attempted killing of an entire race (genocide) is not even remotely similar to a law concerning adultery. Of course we have to step in and stop genocide attempts. 

How would you like it if whatever country you were from suddenly became weak and the US or China or whoever decided to come in and force you to change all your laws to their liking? Do you want some other country telling you that you can't do this and can't do that but have to do this...?

Don't be upset, and don't insult my post. It's not my fault that you're inconsitent.

This mere law you're talking about implies torturing and killing people because of adultery. It's inhumane and should not be happening ANYWHERE! Just because some backwards society made it one of their laws doesn't make it right. And if you're advocating for such cultural relativism, then you shouldn't have anything against the Holocaust. After all, it was a policy created by the German state, and the general population seemed to agree with it (didn't see them rising up and protesting against it). This policy was also a high point of a cultural phenomenon that began in the Middle Ages and was made popular by Chrsitians, so it could definately be viewed as being compatible with the culture of Germany.

Stop being a hypocrite. Either you're for cultural relativism of this level, or you're against it.

How am I inconsistent and how are the holocaust and stoning to death of adulterers (nothing new or radical) anything similar?

I'm for a nations sovereignty to make their own laws but of course when it reaches the stages of genocide or something crazy then we have to step in.



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Chairman-Mao on 01 February 2011
rocketpig said:
Chairman-Mao said:
highwaystar101 said:
Chairman-Mao said:

Look I know their society seems backwards to us with laws like this, but even so; the law is the law. She knew adultery was wrong in her society and she chose to do it anyways and paid for it. 

Maybe there's a society out there where stealing isn't wrong and they think we're retarded for punishing thieves?


Except it's not the law, and that was clear in the article. It was an illegal stoning carried out by a terrorist group, not as a product of the justice system. The people who carried out the stoning are now wanted men.

That's not to say stoning isn't part of the justice system in other countries, because it is, and that's something that I and much of the world find disturbing.

And I do respect your approach to moral relativism, but you're still allowed to be outraged from a personal point of view, even though there is no set code of morals that all societies can live by. And pushing to get unreasonable laws with inhumane punishments revoked has been something mankind has always benefited from.


I didn't realize that (the part I underlined). In that case I will take back what I said.

I do however stand by a nation's right to sovereignty as long as its "legal" (passed by their legitimate government). 

So, tell me what you think of Rwanda, Darfur, or mid-90s Bosnia. I'm dying to hear your opinion.

Like I've said before, I'm against genocide. I don't get how people compare one person being stoned to death for what they knew was a crime before they did it to the genocides of thousands of people. 



sabby_e17 on 01 February 2011

To hell with these terrorists. They've made such a bad impression on Islam and continue to misguide young and uneducated folk...and they will pay for this one day.




kingofbubba on 01 February 2011
huaxiong90 said:
Joelcool7 said:

Its illegal in several countries to convert to any religion other then Islam. If you do so it is punishable by death. Should we respect those countries soveirgnty and allow them to commit acts of genocide against those who convert. In other countries like Eritria its illegal to be anything other then Islam not only convert.

Should we stand by and watch these countries butcher their people because we respect their soveirgnty? Its the same as standing by while Hitler executed the Jews. Now I know our Governments currently are standing by and allowing several countries to butcher their people, but the question remains "Should they"?

I hope that Nato and the Afghan National Army arrest or kill every one of those responsable for this hanous act. May justice be served hot!

I don't even consider these countries "Islamic" if they force people to convert. That's just extremist scum abusing the Islamic name. In fact, the Quran states that it's forbidden to force people into your religion:  (No compulsion in religion) (Al-Baqarah 2:256)

This is a pretty good article (assuming you read the whole thing from beginning to end)

edit: forgot the link! whoops! http://www.meforum.org/1754/peace-or-jihad-abrogation-in-islam

That all being said, I read some interesting article on abrogation (written by a born-muslim: http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Farooq_Ibrahim/abrogation.htm ) that actually talked about rules (and abrogation of rules) regarding the penalty for adultry/fornication but it wasn't clear what the final ruling is...either way I think the penalty of death didn't fit the crime.



superchunk on 01 February 2011
kingofbubba said:
huaxiong90 said:

I don't even consider these countries "Islamic" if they force people to convert. That's just extremist scum abusing the Islamic name. In fact, the Quran states that it's forbidden to force people into your religion:  (No compulsion in religion) (Al-Baqarah 2:256)

This is a pretty good article (assuming you read the whole thing from beginning to end)

edit: forgot the link! whoops! http://www.meforum.org/1754/peace-or-jihad-abrogation-in-islam

That all being said, I read some interesting article on abrogation (written by a born-muslim: http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Farooq_Ibrahim/abrogation.htm ) that actually talked about rules (and abrogation of rules) regarding the penalty for adultry/fornication but it wasn't clear what the final ruling is...either way I think the penalty of death didn't fit the crime.

Abrogation is not part of the Qur'an. That is newer extreamist tools used to push their view of what they want Islam to be.



dtewi on 01 February 2011
Chairman-Mao said:

Like I've said before, I'm against genocide. I don't get how people compare one person being stoned to death for what they knew was a crime before they did it to the genocides of thousands of people. 


Are you taking the moral high ground because you actually believe it?

Or did you read a Wikipedia article about relative morals?

Look, stoning, the act of actually chucking heavy, solid objects into a person's face just for having sex, is downright despicable.

They are wrong. Extremists are always wrong.



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Itsudatte itsudatte itsudatte

Sugu yoko de waratteita

Nakushitemo torimodosu kimi wo

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