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Forums - General Discussion - Islam and Christianity are almost the same!

Showertea said:

Wait, so, like, is Islam a code-word for the next Microsoft console, and Christianity a code-word for the next Sony one? I'm not really sure what this has to do with video game sale statistics.


Yeah! what the hell are you guys doing in the sales forum! oh wait......

There is a reason why its called the off-topic forums... you know. Where people can talk whatever they want as long as it doesn't break the rule.




              

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Even if people were more educated about both religions, it wouldn't stop this conflict between the two.

Even the people within that exact same religion fight, ie Catholics vs Protestants - no matter how small the difference may seem, it's usually a pretty big deal when it comes to religion.



Showertea said:

Wait, so, like, is Islam a code-word for the next Microsoft console, and Christianity a code-word for the next Sony one? I'm not really sure what this has to do with video game sale statistics.


I think you got a bit lost, this is the off-topic forum where we often talking about Christianity and Islam. The sales forum is where we talk about video game sales statistics.

@Aj-habfan. And the Sunni and Shia really don't get along either.



The issue with dealing or appreciating Islam if you do not already do so or you do not know Islam or you do know Islam but do not study it and it's history and it's contexts enough to show your lack of ignorance;  is that you must abandon what is right and wrong or that you understand as right and wrong first then grasp what is right and wrong by the Qu' ran and not by any other text or word of mouth.

In the Qu' ran it is said that a womans place is under the foot a her husband, I can't remember if it was her face or her as in the whole of woman.

In the Qu' ran Muhammad slew a breast feeding mother and ripped her in two, when his followers discovered this he cited that two goats would not clash heads over this - to take the value of that statement to english to an Arab two goats clashing heads is a meanial thing as goats clash heads over any little thing and so the slaying of a woman to Muhammad was not even something menial it was less than menial.

Qu' ran 9:30 clearly states that Christians and Jews are unbelievers, it also claims that the Christians claim that Jesus is the son of Allah and that this is a tale made up by them (like wise with the jews) and that this qualifies Christians as Pagans or unbelievers (this was after Jews and Christians rejected Muhammad) In this it sais that it is fine to slay Jews and Christians though most Muslims claim that Christians, Jews and Islamics are brothers of the book... (naive)

To go further in Qu' ran 9:73 Muhammad again makes clear that Jihad must be execised on all unbelievers and non-believers.  He even goes to say that unbelievers are but fuel for the fires of hell. =)

Gay's have been on recorded history for millenias and they are reffered to in the Qu' ran as unbelievers to be gay is to be against Muhammad and his teachings. Since Muhammad is Allah as Allah can only be heard in the Qu' ran through Muhammad it is fair to say that gays are against the teachings of Allah and are nothing more than "fuel for  hell fire." - Qu' ran 72:15

Islam however is in a state of do or die, the religion is imploding as modernizations have begun to seep their way into the territories, Islam does not promote secular conversation yet female news broad casters have begun asking questions within Saudi Arabia bringing attention to honor killings, beatings and acid attacks most of which are done by a male within the family.

But while the women may be fighting an up hill battle against 1400 years of oppression the other change is with the Muhammadan male who is demanded to perform Jihad by Allah, and if not to perform Jihad then to aid Jihad in any way prefferably financially. Males in Arab society have begun to draw questions on the continuity of their laws and what the grace of Allah means. A gentle Allah does not command men to torture others yet in the Qu' ran there is no gentle Allah, where did this gentle Allah come from? These are questions that mark the end of ignorance and the begining of self-education.

Muslims are human beings in the end, but the holy book the Qu' ran guides them or those that follow it's teachings in a way that seems hostile to the all who suffer the wrath of Islam and if not hostile then down right psychotic. But to the world of Islam this is right, and I say - fair enough.

To conclude no where in the Qu' ranic verses does it mention to show compasion to the non-believers, it also explains that the non-believers is anyone ANYONE who does not believe Muhammad and Islam.



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babuks said:

@ BrayanA

You have tried to show Jizya as a bad thing. You can think of it this way, we Muslims give zakat which is a religious duty and don't force the non-muslims to perform the duty of Islam. So, they have a tax to pay imposed from an Islamic state. You have to give some sort of tax as a citizen. So, Muslims give zakat and Non-Muslims give Jizya.

Now, can you tell me about the condition of the immigrants to your country from poor or underdeveloped countries? Do they have the same working and living right like you as citizen have? What if the immigrant has entered your country illegally.

Now, an immigrant can get a green card or citizenship only when he agrees to abide by the law of your country. So, you are forcing him to follow your law in order to allow him the right to stay in your country. But if an Islamic country wants to do the same thing by saying that if you want to stay in a Islamic country as non-muslim, you must pay Jizya, it becomes hard for you.

 

@ LostPlanet 22,

Liberal?  That's why the British couple had to go to jail for a kiss?  If that is kind of Liberal you like I pass;.

Perhaps you can explain the boycotting of Army Generals the meeting with the President because his wife wore hijab on the head (this is an incident of Turkey few days ago). So, you want to liberate the people by not allowing them to wear what he or she likes?

If being nude in public is prohibited in your law, what is the wrong for and Islamic state to prohibit kissing in public? Why do you always think what you prohibit is always right and what others do is not?

This is where I pass.

@babuks
you only fotgot that zakat was twice lower than jizya and some times even more. You also forgot that christians were not immigrants but locals, on the contrary muslims were not locals but invaders.

For example - in Ottoman empire in 1490 form Sofia Sanjak, muslim families with a member in the army paid 7 akche, muslim families without a member in the army  - 22-24 akche, christians families - 74-76 akche. Or in other words christians paid 3 times more then muslims. This was one of the main ways muslims pressured non-muslins to convert.



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Okay on the issue with the mosques in Jerusilem... well.. here:

"

When this Qur'anic passage was first revealed, in about 621, a place called the Sacred Mosque already existed in Mecca. In contrast, the "furthest mosque" was a turn of phrase, not a place. Some early Muslims understood it as metaphorical or as a place in heaven.14 And if the "furthest mosque" did exist on earth, Palestine would seem an unlikely location, for many reasons. Some of them:

Elsewhere in the Qur'an (30:1), Palestine is called "the closest land" (adna al-ard).

Palestine had not yet been conquered by the Muslims and contained not a single mosque.

The "furthest mosque" was apparently identified with places inside Arabia: either Medina15 or a town called Ji‘rana, about ten miles from Mecca, which the Prophet visited in 630.16

The earliest Muslim accounts of Jerusalem, such as the description of Caliph ‘Umar's reported visit to the city just after the Muslims conquest in 638, nowhere identify the Temple Mount with the "furthest mosque" of the Qur'an.

The Qur'anic inscriptions that make up a 240-meter mosaic frieze inside the Dome of the Rock do not include Qur'an 17:1 and the story of the Night Journey, suggesting that as late as 692 the idea of Jerusalem as the lift-off for the Night Journey had not yet been established. (Indeed, the first extant inscriptions of Qur'an 17:1 in Jerusalem date from the eleventh century.)

Muhammad ibn al-Hanafiya (638-700), a close relative of the Prophet Muhammad, is quoted denigrating the notion that the prophet ever set foot on the Rock in Jerusalem; "these damned Syrians," by which he means the Umayyads, "pretend that God put His foot on the Rock in Jerusalem, though [only] one person ever put his foot on the rock, namely Abraham."17

Then, in 715, to build up the prestige of their dominions, the Umayyads did a most clever thing: they built a second mosque in Jerusalem, again on the Temple Mount, and called this one the Furthest Mosque (al-masjid al-aqsa, Al-Aqsa Mosque). With this, the Umayyads retroactively gave the city a role in Muhammad's life. This association of Jerusalem with al-masjid al-aqsa fit into a wider Muslim tendency to identify place names found in the Qur'an: "wherever the Koran mentions a name of an event, stories were invented to give the impression that somehow, somewhere, someone, knew what they were about."18

Despite all logic (how can a mosque built nearly a century after the Qur'an was received establish what the Qur'an meant?), building an actual Al-Aqsa Mosque, the Palestinian historian A. L. Tibawi writes, "gave reality to the figurative name used in the Koran."19 It also had the hugely important effect of inserting Jerusalem post hoc into the Qur'an and making it more central to Islam. Also, other changes resulted. Several Qur'anic passages were re-interpreted to refer to this city.20 Jerusalem came to be seen as the site of the Last Judgment. The Umayyads cast aside the non-religious Roman name for the city, Aelia Capitolina (in Arabic, Iliya) and replaced it with Jewish-style names, either Al-Quds (The Holy) or Bayt al-Maqdis (The Temple). They sponsored a form of literature praising the "virtues of Jerusalem," a genre one author is tempted to call "Zionist."21 Accounts of the prophet's sayings or doings (Arabic: hadiths, often translated into English as "Traditions") favorable to Jerusalem emerged at this time, some of them equating the city with Mecca.22 There was even an effort to move the pilgrimage (hajj) from Mecca to Jerusalem."

 

TLDR: Those mosques in Jerusilem were made retroactively to when the Qu'rans final form had been compiled. In todays tounge such an act would be clearly propoganda - now forgive and forget is fine but twisting history is true blasphemy.



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Youre joking right, look at this list and please tell me that islam isnt the EXACT OPPOSITE of christianity

 

Muhammad...

Jesus...

Said Allah hates those who don't accept Islam.
(Qur'an 30:4, 3:32, 22:38)
Said God loves everyone. 
(John 3:16)
"I have been commanded to fight
against people till they testify that there
 is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad
 is the messenger of Allah"

(Muslim 1:33)
"He who lives by the sword
will die by the sword."

(Matthew 26:52)
Stoned women for adultery.
(Muslim 4206)
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."
(John 8:7)
Permitted stealing from unbelievers.
(Bukhari 44:668, Ibn Ishaq 764)
"Thou shalt not steal."
(Matthew 19:18)
Permitted lying.
(Sahih Muslim 6303, Bukhari 49:857)
"Thou shalt not bear false witness."
(Matthew 19:18)
Owned and traded slaves.
(Sahih Muslim 3901)
Neither owned nor traded slaves.
Beheaded 800 Jewish men and boys.
(Sahih Muslim 4390)
Beheaded no one.
Murdered those who insulted him.
(Bukhari 56:369, 4:241)
Preached forgiveness.
(Matthew 18:21-22, 5:38)
"If then anyone transgresses
the prohibition against you,
Transgress ye likewise against him"
(Qur'an 2:194)
"If someone strikes you on the right
cheek, turn to him the other also."
(Matthew 5:39)
Jihad in the way of Allah elevates one's position in Paradise by a hundred fold.
(Muslim 4645)
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for
they will be called Sons of God"
(Matthew 5:9)
Married 13 wives and kept sex slaves.
(Bukhari 5:268, Qur'an 33:50)
Was celibate.
Slept with a 9-year-old child.
(Sahih Muslim 3309, Bukhari 58:236)
Did not have sex with children.
Ordered the murder of women.
(Ibn Ishaq 819, 995)
Never harmed a woman. 
"O you who believe!  Fight those of the
 unbelievers who are near to you
and let them find in you hardness."

(Qur'an 3:110)
"Blessed are the meek, for
they shall inherit the earth."

(Matthew 5:5)
Ordered 65 military campaigns
and raids in his last 10 years.
(Ibn Ishaq )
Ordered no military campaigns, nor
offered any approval of war or violence. 
 
Killed captives taken in battle.
(Ibn Ishaq 451)
Never took captives.
Never killed anyone.
Encouraged his men to rape enslaved women.
(Abu Dawood 2150, Qur'an 4:24)
Never encouraged rape.
Never enslaved women. 
Demanded captured slaves and
a fifth of all other loot taken in war.
(Qur'an 8:41)
"The Son of Man came not
to be served, but to serve.
"
(Matthew 20:28)
Was never tortured, but tortured others.
(Muslim 4131, Ibn Ishaq 436, 595, 734, 764)
Suffered torture, but never tortured anyone.
"And fight them until there is no more persecution and religion is only for Allah"
(Qur'an 8:39)
"Love your enemies and pray
for those who persecute you
"
(Matthew 5:44)
Ordered a slave to build the very pulpit
from which he preached Islam.
(Bukhari 47:743)
Washed his disciples feet.
(John 13:5)
What are the Greatest Commandments?
"Belief in Allah and Jihad in His cause"
(Muslim 1:149)
What are the Greatest Commandments?
"Love God and love thy neighbor as thyself."
(Matthew 22:34-40)
Demanded the protection of armed bodyguards, even in a house of worship
(Qur'an 4:102)
Chastised anyone attempting
to defend him with force.
(John 18:10-12)
Died fat and wealthy from what was
taken from others in war or
demanded from others in tribute.
Demanded nothing for himself. 
Died without possessions.
Advocated crucifying others.
(Qur'an 5:33, Muslim 16:4131)
Was crucified himself.
According to his followers:
Had others give their lives for him.
(Sahih Muslim 4413)
According to his followers:
Gave his life for others.
(John 18:11 and elsewhere)


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