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fatslob-:O said:

I don't know if I'd say AMD is 'beating' Intel when they still have some gaming performance advantages but at the very least it could be considered a 'stalemate' ...

AMD needs to break the stalemate and improve their gaming performance fast before Intel reacts (they're good at this) but maybe just maybe they'll finally go down and quietly at that ... 

When AMD's Ryzen chips beats Intels chips in gaming, they do so by a fairly significant margin... It's the games that leverage the extra threads and impressive cache amounts where AMD's chips truly shine.

When Intel finally release it's 10nm chips to compete with Ryzen 3000, AMD will likely be gearing up for it's Ryzen 4000 series, so they have a good cadence going on now if they play their chips right.

In saying that... I find it overtly difficult to recommend Intel's CPU's right now, which is a complete role reversal back in the AMD FX days, not only are Intel CPU's  generally more expensive, they consume more power and tend to have lesser performance, especially in heavily threaded scenarios.

Whether the 16-core model ends up being bandwidth starved with only Dual-Channel DDR when all 32-threads are pegged should be an interesting benchmark/review to read I think.

fatslob-:O said:
Pemalite said:

As for Navi or the Radeon RX 5700XT... Anyone who buys those GPU's for 1080P gaming is a moron or is chasing greater than 60fps, they aren't the ideal resolutions that showcases Vega 7's insane memory bandwidth... In saying that, Navi does blow out transistor counts somewhat.

Of course Intel are going to use smaller nodes for Desktop CPU's. Wow. 10nm isn't where the buck stops.

The VAST MAJORITY of current laptop display resolutions today are overwhelmingly sub-1080p!

Irrelevant. No Laptop is using a desktop Radeon RX 5700XT. - In-fact a mobile variant doesn't even exist yet.

fatslob-:O said:

The fact that Navi can match a Radeon VII using HBM2 memory in 1080p graphics performance while using ~25% less power is a substantial improvement and that especially counts when most systems won't be able to supply the GPU with tons of power like we see on desktop ... (Navi still uses less die area than the Radeon VII coming in at a ~25% smaller die size)

Navi is a substantial improvement, no doubt about it. - But the Radeon 5700XT at 7nm is still not able to definitely beat nVidia's 12nm chips... Heck it's still not even able to beat some of nVidia's 16nm chips like the 1080Ti.

Whether Navi is able to scale downwards effectively in terms of TDP still remains to be seen, Vega was actually extremely impressive on this front at lower clocks and voltages, AMD obviously pushed out the efficiency curve with Vega in order to garner better benchmark results on the desktop, power consumption be damned.

fatslob-:O said:

Delivering a Zen 2/Vega combination just to rush out a product is downright sub-optimal. 1080p graphics performance in the portable space will matter for some years to come down the road since reviewers hold lower standards for them in terms of resolution capability in comparison to desktop systems ... (being more efficient at lower resolution is especially important since most portable systems won't have 100s of watts of cooling power to play with) 

I never said they should rush anything.
Integrated Graphics tends to target 720P-1080P... Vega actually doesn't do to bad, it's just bandwidth starved... Which is the Achilles heel of integrated graphics in general.

It would be nice to see Navi, I don't think it's realistic, but what is realistic is Zen 2 at 7nm using Vega for the mobile space.

fatslob-:O said:

As for 10nm being used for desktop CPUs, Intel's current roadmap might say otherwise since they don't plan on having sub-14nm desktop CPUs at least until the end of 2021 ... (definitely not expecting sub-14nm in the near future)

Anyone who thinks Intel will stop at 10nm for the desktop is not someone that should be taken seriously.
Desktop chips are still billions of dollars in revenue... And is used as a platform to build other chips for other lucrative markets.

Fabs don't stop at 10nm.

fatslob-:O said:

By the end of 2020, I expect either a make it or break it revelation from Intel. Intel are either going to have a breakthrough (make it) or finally call it quits and then go fabless (break it) because they can't keep going in like this when their competitor is going to be eyeing 5nm well before they even get to 7nm ... (Intel can't afford to have sagging revenues due to a fierce competitor when logic fabrication R&D is more capitally expensive than ever) 

Intel has hired a key AMD engineer that gave us Zen, Intel could possibly take AMD's approach... Aka. Chiplets.
Not all logic in a CPU scales downwards in geometry, so it makes sense keeping some part of a chip at an older process for cost reasons.

That way... Intel won't have to resort to using it's latest processes just for tiny chips like the 10nm Cannon Lake CPU it released in 2018.

--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--