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dsgrue3 said:
OooSnap said:
@dsgrue

Sorry, I can't use the quote button with the device I am using.

Well, here are more recent quotes:

"Evolutionary biologists have long sought to understand the relationship between microevolution (adaptation), which can be observed both in nature and in the laboratory, and macroevolution (speciation and the origin of the divisions of the taxonomic hierarchy above the species level, and the development of complex organs), which cannot be witnessed because it occurs over intervals that far exceed the human lifespan. . . . [from the abstract] "Macroevolution posed a problem to Darwin because his principle of descent with modification predicts gradual transitions between small-scale adaptive changes in populations and these larger-scale phenomena, yet there is little evidence for such transitions in nature. Instead, the natural world is often characterized by gaps, or discontinuities. One type of gap relates to the existence of 'organs of extreme perfection', such as the eye, or morphological innovations, such as wings, both of which are found fully formed in present-day organisms without leaving evidence of a transition between them. These discontinuities, plus the discontinuous appearance and disappearance of taxa in the fossil record, form the modern conceptual divide between microevolution and macroevolution. . . . "Most evolutionary biologists think that Darwin explained macroevolution simply as microevolution writ large. In fact, Darwin had rather more to say about the relationship between microevolution and macroevolution and invoked additional principles to define it. . . . "Darwin's proposal carries a more general message for contemporary discussions of macroevolution, namely that microevolution alone cannot explain macroevolution." (David N. Reznick and Robert E. Ricklefs, "Darwin's bridge between microevolution and macroevolution." Nature 457:837,838,841, Feb. 12, 2009)

"New concepts and information from molecular, developmental biology, systematics, geology and the fossil record of all groups of organisms, need to be integrated into an expanded evolutionary synthesis. These fields of study show that large-scale evolutionary phenomena cannot be understood solely on the basis of extrapolation from processes observed at the level of modern populations and species. Patterns and rates of evolution are much more varied than had been conceived by Darwin or the evolutionary synthesis, and physical factors of the earth's history have had a significant, but extremely varied, impact on the evolution of life." (Carroll, Robert L. [Curator of Vertebrate Paleontology, Redpath Museum, McGill University, Montreal, Canada], "Towards a new evolutionary synthesis," Trends in Ecology and Evolution, 2000, Vol. 15, pp.27-32, p.27)

For the Berkeley link who is the author?

So why do you still believe it when people in the evolutionist camp have doubts?


As I quoted earlier it was expected to find transitional fossils, hence the quotes. Why did Gould and Eldridge postulate PE?

You do know there are millions of fossils archived? You would think they would have clear cut transitional forms.

Okay.

Well, your first source does nothing to further your argument or deny mine in that they are the same process. It simply says that Darwin, 150 years ago, didn't think microevolution was enough to produce macroevolution. As I've shown already, Darwin was wrong in this regard as current scientist do agree that these are idential processes with only time being the differentiating factor.

Requested Berkeley Source(s):

http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/about.php

I have no idea what you were attempting to address with your second source. It doesn't really say much of anything. It basically says we need to combine the evidence from different scientific fields to synthesize our understanding of evolution, and I think we've done quite a good job at that since that document was written.

We have tons of transitional fossils as I've explained already. You simply want ALL of them and that's an unrealistic expectation. Here you go:

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part1a.html#fish

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part1b.html

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part2a.html

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part2b.html

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part2c.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_transitional_fossils

http://www.transitionalfossils.com/

There are probably even more than millions of fossils, they are simply duplicates. But when there are an estimated 1-4 billion species to have existed, it's not at all surprising.

Punctuated equillibrium is still an evolutionary theory, not a creationist one, so I have no idea why you're arguing for it as it still would go against what you believe.



"Evolutionary biologists have long sought to understand the relationship between microevolution (adaptation), which can be observed both in nature and in the laboratory, and macroevolution (speciation and the origin of the divisions of the taxonomic hierarchy above the species level, and the development of complex organs), which cannot be witnessed because it occurs over intervals that far exceed the human lifespan. . . . [from the abstract] "Macroevolution posed a problem to Darwin because his principle of descent with modification predicts gradual transitions between small-scale adaptive changes in populations and these larger-scale phenomena, yet there is little evidence for such transitions in nature. Instead, the natural world is often characterized by gaps, or discontinuities. One type of gap relates to the existence of 'organs of extreme perfection', such as the eye, or morphological innovations, such as wings, both of which are found fully formed in present-day organisms without leaving evidence of a transition between them. These discontinuities, plus the discontinuous appearance and disappearance of taxa in the fossil record, form the modern conceptual divide between microevolution and macroevolution. . . . "Most evolutionary biologists think that Darwin explained macroevolution simply as microevolution writ large. In fact, Darwin had rather more to say about the relationship between microevolution and macroevolution and invoked additional principles to define it. . . . "Darwin's proposal carries a more general message for contemporary discussions of macroevolution, namely that microevolution alone cannot explain macroevolution." (David N. Reznick and Robert E. Ricklefs, "Darwin's bridge between microevolution and macroevolution." Nature 457:837,838,841, Feb. 12, 2009)

"New concepts and information from molecular, developmental biology, systematics, geology and the fossil record of all groups of organisms, need to be integrated into an expanded evolutionary synthesis. These fields of study show that large-scale evolutionary phenomena cannot be understood solely on the basis of extrapolation from processes observed at the level of modern populations and species. Patterns and rates of evolution are much more varied than had been conceived by Darwin or the evolutionary synthesis, and physical factors of the earth's history have had a significant, but extremely varied, impact on the evolution of life." (Carroll, Robert L. [Curator of Vertebrate Paleontology, Redpath Museum, McGill University, Montreal, Canada], "Towards a new evolutionary synthesis," Trends in Ecology and Evolution, 2000, Vol. 15, pp.27-32, p.27)

Did you read it carefully? It reads macroevolution can't be observed and it can't be extrapoloated from processes observed  at the population level.

None of your links show any photos that gives credence that it is an intermediate form nor is there anything about consensus of scientists that endorse their claim. Moreover there is no scientific evidence in any of your links that support its claims. Claiming something is an transitional form is much easier than providing scientific evidence that it is. Paleontology is a very subjective science

As you know if you have read the quotes, scientists admit the fossil record doesn't give credence to the evolution story.  You can read the quotes here http://www.genesispark.com/exhibits/fossils/missing-links/gaps/

I never argued for Punctuated Equilibrium. It was a theory postulated to explain away the absence of clear cut transitional forms that would give credence to the evolution story. Gould was open about the absence of transitional forms "The absence of fossil evidence for intermediary stages between major transitions in organic design, indeed our inability, even in our imagination, to construct functional intermediates in many cases, has been a persistent and nagging problem for gradualistic accounts of evolution." (Gould; Evolution Now: A Century After Darwin)."