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Forums - Gaming Discussion - EA/DICE mocks critics of BFV at launch party

KManX89 said:

 

KLAMarine said:
This image seems dodgy to me... Is there actual footage of the event?

No live footage, but that screencap was an actual presentation during the event. EA/DICE continued to act like petulant children and call anyone who disapproves a sexist bigot while putting words in their mouth to boot. Spoiler: that's not what most of the detractors were saying.

But with no footage, I fear this image could have been altered. Surely this event has footage available somewhere...



pokoko said:
flashfire926 said:

Game was down 85% in pre-orders, compared to Black Ops 4, then 65% down in sales UK when comparing the first two weeks of battlefield 1 to 5. Target and Best Buy dropped the game's price to $30 just a week after launch. As a result EA's stock is also 40% down compared to E3 time.

Keep digging your own grave, DICE. For once I'm going to be clapping if a studio goes belly up.

This is exactly what happens when you pander to an audience that doesnt even play games.

You'll be clapping if 600 people lose their jobs?  Most of whom didn't have a say in the direction of the game?  Just to spite some top dog studio heads who will have another job within a week?

Jesus fucking Christ.  

Ultimately that's the saddest part in this. If EA gets no repercutions out of this, they would've come out scot free from insulting their audience by both PR and the quality of the product sold. If EA does get repercutions out of this, most of DICE's staff is eventually either going to go unnemployed or absorbed into other studios. People who most likely did not really agree with whoever decided this approach to marketing/game design was a good thing.



You know it deserves the GOTY.

Come join The 2018 Obscure Game Monthly Review Thread.

gamers sure do find the stupidest things to get upset about so what if there's females in a ww2 game



If this means EA is one step closer to going under, then keep the insults coming!



Baddman said:
gamers sure do find the stupidest things to get upset about so what if there's females in a ww2 game

Then why not include Resistance women in the game, you know, women who were actually in WW2? But nope, gotta rewrite history and call people uneducated and act like conceited jackasses all in an effort to appease people who won't buy our game, anyway! 

I guar-damn-tee you if they made their own original modern day shooter with a cricket bat-wielding prosthetic-armed woman, there wouldn't be nearly as much backlash as this game is getting, but keep pretending this is about "hating inclusivity". 



At some point you have to wonder if capitalism will get these companies to recenter themselves. I try to see things through the other side's perspective and I can understand the desire to hopefully expand your audience and appeal to people that might not normally play your game. As a father of a daughter, I can certainly understand the sentiment of wanting to make this game relevant to females. That said, the way they did all of this was very poorly planned and executed. When people had issue with the historical accuracy of the game, they chose to conflate the smaller number of oddball complaints with the larger number of legitimate criticisms of the game. Essentially they took a play out of the current Star Wars playbook to say that if you don't like it, you must be a bad person. Your criticism can't possibly be valid. From there, these companies just keep doubling down.

It is not wise to sacrifice your current user base in the attempt to gain new fans from a group that simply might not be that interested in your product. The only real indicator will be sales though. So if everything works out and sales aren't negatively impacted, they will keep doing these things. If sales tank, the almighty dollar will most likely make them reevaluate the strategy.



"There are things which, if done by the few, we should refuse to imitate; yet when the majority have begun to do them, we follow along - just as if anything were more honourable because it is more frequent!"

-Seneca

Welp, that’s money they won’t be getting.



0331 Happiness is a belt-fed weapon

KManX89 said:
Baddman said:
gamers sure do find the stupidest things to get upset about so what if there's females in a ww2 game

Then why not include Resistance women in the game, you know, women who were actually in WW2? But nope, gotta rewrite history and call people uneducated and act like conceited jackasses all in an effort to appease people who won't buy our game, anyway! 

I guar-damn-tee you if they made their own original modern day shooter with a cricket bat-wielding prosthetic-armed woman, there wouldn't be nearly as much backlash as this game is getting, but keep pretending this is about "hating inclusivity". 

I'm not pretending anything its stupid to get upset over a game having a female character no matter the time period.  Its a videogame



Jaxyfoo said:

I am torn on this debate, because I generally back equality and progression. However this whole incident is part of some crazy rewriting of history in a way which is Absolutely wrong full stop. Women fought in every capacity going further back, and in some countries did indeed have limited frontline combat in the past two wars.

Most of the key players in the second world war banned women's frontline combat. That ban has only been lifted within the last few years in most of these countries. 2016 in the UK. Women provided lots of secondary roles. Anti aircraft guns, medical care, intelligence, engineering and good support work. To celebrate that work would be fine. But to rewrite history for the sake of pilot correctness is a lie. It is more political incorrectness. I won't support falsification of the truth to reflect current values in any form. We are in the process of killing our own human knowledge base based on agendas.

They should have changed the time period of set the game in a Wolfenstein style alternative reality. There is a huge disconnect between gaming companies. There are too many using horrible practices to suit the men in suits and PR departments over the gaming fans. This has worked moderately for a few years. Now with the internet having more direct input people's lives, people are being educated how wrong these practices are. The companies who are the worst here will kill themselves instead of changing. I just hope that when we come out the other side gaming has become a nice honest environment again in every way. Sadly when these companies begin to downsize and cut loved projects, they will blame the fans for voting against bad practice by not giving them support for it. I wish mobile gaming had never become a thing, because too many of the models came from there. It is destroying gaming for traditional gamers.

But the SJW topic is just misleading.

BFV is full with issues, a small amount of maps, it feels like a downgraded game compared to other BF games. You may check Angry Joes review it helps to understand the issues with the game.

EA is just spinning the issues around.






My take on this is that DICE is free to do whatever they wish with their games. If they want a bunch of women on the frontlines of World War 2 then go for it. People are entitled to their opinions. Some people want to see that in games. Others don't. Neither side is actually wrong for wanting the game to be one thing or another. The question shouldn't be "who is wrong for wanting the game a certain way" but rather "will DICE's decision to take this direction with their game hurt them"?

Looking at how badly Battlefield 5 was behind Black Ops 4 in pre-orders months ago (85% behind compared to Battlefield 1 being ahead of Infinite Warfare) and the report that physical sales of this latest entry were well below those of the previous, seemingly to the point where one cannot reasonably argue that digital sales made up for it and still well below Call of Duty, it seems to me that DICE may have hurt themselves with this decision. The critical reception of the game is lower than any main entries in the franchise with many complaints ranging from a lack of content to a fair amount of technical issues. This isn't going to help.

There also seems to be a complete lack of the customization options involving prosthetic limbs that raised some eyebrows from the initial trailer. So not only did DICE disregard the vocal critics of the community to some extent but they then failed to implement something those on the other side of the aisle praised them for. Whether this will eventually find its way in is unknown but there is certainly the sense that DICE backtracked on some of its more arguably absurd cosmetic decisions. This tells me that DICE definitely felt the pinch and while they conceded a bit for now, they're still not prepared to admit they may have made a bad choice.

They may very well want to re-evaluate whether patting themselves on the back for attempting to be inclusive is worth losing that much market share and income. If doing this was supposed to bring more people into the fold but ultimately ended up losing them a ton of sales then questions should be raised. Why didn't the people who supported this make up for the people who didn't? If such a thing was so important and such a barrier to entry for people then why are sales so far down compared to the previous title and the competitor? Are the people who we disregarded such a significant portion of our income? Is it worth us losing a lot of sales to take our games in that direction? Either they press on with this new philosophy for their game design and hope it works out or they abandon it and go back to making games the way it seems their currently established fanbase prefers.

All that being said, something I touched on earlier in my post is the REAL issue with Battlefield 5 at this point is not even what the reasons behind the decrease in initial sales were. Rather, how the game has so many issues for those who bought it. When you take an already much lower base of players and subject them to a game lacking in content and with a number of technical issues... well... DICE may not be able to recover this game's already tarnished image. The first update they just released is causing all servers to have a moderate amount of ping. At least last I checked. Your biggest competitor had its Battle Royale mode on Day 1, has been praised for it, and is already expanding on it. Meanwhile, you tell your customers to wait 4 months for your version of it and with hardly any info on it. Black Ops 4 has enjoyed some pretty good press. Battlefield 5 has been caked in negativity since its reveal. This is DICE dropping the ball at nearly every turn.