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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Third party Switch ports don't necessarily need to sell as much as PS4 to be successful

Liquid_faction said:
curl-6 said:

"Milking COD on PS3/360" and making some extra cash from Wii ports are not mutually exclusive. You can have both, and they did. If COD on Wii was not making money, they would not have brought over 5 of them over 5 years. If World at War didn't earn its keep, it was easily early enough to pull the plug on Black Ops and MW3.

Yes they did, but my point is not whether they made a profit or not, its how big the profit margin is to keep bringing it to the system at that time. COD was not as big in those 5 times they brought over COD. So if they made a couple million here or there, off course they would be happy. In the current Activision, a couple million here and there is not enough. So hypothetically, If a game is made on Switch with a budget of 20 million dollars, but the developers only managed to recuperate 1 million along with the 20 million budget, you're still making 1 million, but in a business standpoint, you'd be stupid investing 20 million to only get 1 million back. Knock off the first three CODs, because COD was not a big franchise back then, so any profits they made was already expected, and knock off last two CODs because by the time COD became a billion dollar franchise, Black Ops and MW3 were already being developed. You need more modern examples, because information about COD and Activision in the Wii era is simply outdated.

COD on Wii didn't have a 2 year development cycle like the base games did back then, it had a 1 year cycle by a special team at Treyarch. There was plenty of time to can BO1 and MW3 for Wii after the series exploded.

As for recent examples, the Wii U was a bomb and the Switch hasn't been around long enough for there to be examples of long term support, though it does have examples of third parties doing well with games like Skyrim, FIFA, and the numerous indie success stories.



Agree...but this might only applies to those games mentioned in the article since they make a great amount of sales in PS4 and XBOX.



As a point to further strengthen your argument, modern game engines like Unity, Unreal, etc further lower the costs of porting games across multiple platforms. Switch will be fine, as long as it actually CAN run the game, without too much work.



Of course it doesn't *especially if it is a late port* but even Switch right now doesn't have the anywhere near the same size of user-base yet because it's a new console. Anyway Switch has had plenty of third party success already to justify all the third party support it's been given. -and some these haven't been simple either, or a cheap half assed tactic to try and get a few more sales with an unpolished lazy port. 



or resolution lol



 

 

Offocurse it doenst, it needs to sell just some number to become profitable, selling at full price point some games need to sell only few hundred thousand to become profitable, espacily when we talk about ports vs brand new games cost development.



curl-6 said:

An argument I often see leveraged against the Switch is that third party games "don't sell on it", and that because many games sell better on PS4, that means their Switch sales are bad and there's no reason to keep bringing them over.

This reasoning, however, doesn't really hold up to scrutiny. Let's cast our memories back to the Wii. 5 Call of Duty games were ported to the Wii from 2006 to 2011. With the exception of COD3, these all sold less than 2 million, yet they kept coming, year after year. If they weren't profitable, Activision would've called it quits after 1 or 2. Sure, sales were a fraction of the PS3 and 360 versions, but that didn't matter; they obviously did well enough to earn money.

Generally speaking, it's not all that expensive to port a game that already exists. The game itself may need to sell millions in total to turn a profit, but a port might only need to sell, say, 500k to recoup the costs of conversion.

Take Skyrim on Switch; it's well on its way to cruise comfortably passed the million mark, (if it hasn't already) and while it probably won't sell as much as the PS4 version, it doesn't need to; as a port, it could likely do 800k lifetime and still turn a profit for Bethesda, and at the end of the day that's what matters, not whether it's the best selling version, but whether it makes money.

Now, obviously there are other factors, like how difficult a specific game would be to port. But the arguments that "oh it sold less on Switch so it wasn't successful" or "it wouldn't sell as much as the PS4 version so why bother" are fundamentally flawed and illogical.

I think you even overestimate the cost of porting. I think most ports are getting profitable with some 10K to 100K copies sold.

But that is not all that gies in such a decision. Profit alone isn't enough. It is the proportion of profit to resources used. So a small team could do a port - or they could do something else. If the something else gives even more profit, the company will go that route. I think that we see so much porting work by external studios - like Panic button - is a result of that. They can cash in on the possible profit on Switch and build a userbase on that platform, while the main internal teams can still work on lucrative projects.



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DonFerrari said:

Selling less than on another platform obviously turn it in less successful, but I rarely see it used as argument. It is mostly it sold so low that the port was meaningless, and that isn't selling a little less than PS4 or X1 but considerably less.

And devs aren't dumb. So we pretty much know also that if a port can be made and turn profit they will more likely do than not. So this should also debunk any theory of conspiracy that a port isn't on Switch because devs are dumb or hate Nintendo.

That alone isn't enough. A dev has only so much resources and has to decide which projects the resources are used for. A port to Switch can be prioritized low, even if it is profitable (which is most likely for most of the ports).

Also I don't see where you take your assumption Switch sell considerably less than XBox One. I showed here already, that existing multiplats sell about as well on Switch as on Xbox One (17 sell better on Switch, 15 better on XB1): http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8833537



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GoOnKid said:
DonFerrari said:

Selling less than on another platform obviously turn it in less successful, but I rarely see it used as argument. It is mostly it sold so low that the port was meaningless, and that isn't selling a little less than PS4 or X1 but considerably less.

And devs aren't dumb. So we pretty much know also that if a port can be made and turn profit they will more likely do than not. So this should also debunk any theory of conspiracy that a port isn't on Switch because devs are dumb or hate Nintendo.

Have you read the story behind the port of the Crash N Sane Trilogy on Switch? It was just one single developer testing out the first level on the Switch hardware out of curiosity. He saw that it worked and it took him very little effort. Then he showed that to his superiors and the port was greenlighted. So what can we learn from this?

We see how Activisions' management never considered this port in the first place. The management never even thought about checking if it was possible at all. They straight up ignored a new rising system which had a strong entry into the market and hosts an audience which is known to enjoy platformers. So how do you call a decision like that? Exactly, it's dumb.

And that will be more common than people here seem to think. After all management are people, and they more often than not decide based on their gut. Some may say: but they need to make the best decisions or management will be swapped. But that's not true. All they need is to make decision that are good enough. It doesn't matter if there were theoretically better options, as long as the chosen options works out well enough. Only if the decision turn out to be catastrophic the management jobs are in real danger. So managers care about the big decisions. Some small projects with small costs and small profits rarely matter.



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Yep, they don't. But they should sell enough to make up for the costs of the port, which in some scenarios might not be the case and will be the reason why certain ports are not happening.



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